The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 2 years ago

Why Chat is a Necessary Sales Channel w/ Dan Gottlieb


If you’re 30 years old, you grew up using AOL Instant Messenger to build relationships.

They are the people making business decisions today.

On this episode of the The Sales Engagement Podcast, I talk with Dan Gottlieb about why chat is so revolutionary now and why it’s changing sales.

Dan is an Analyst at Topo, a research and advisory firm that helps companies adopt the patterns and plays to achieve drive revenue and grow faster.

Lead Forms are not immediate, they’re not interactive, and they don’t necessarily connect you to the right person right away. But Chat might have big potential in the near future to effect more than just the early stage of inbound.

Dan breaks down the reasons Chat has tremendous potential for your business and answers some of the objections to why companies don’t invest in it.

Welcome to the sales engagement podcast.This podcast is brought to you by outreach dot ioh, the leading sales engagementplatform helping companies, sellers and customer success engaged with buyers and customers in themodern sales era. Check out sales engagementcom for new episodes resources in the bookon sales engagement coming soon. Now let's get into today's episode. Everyone.Welcome back to the sales engagement podcast. We have another incredible, insane,absolutely awesome episode today. My name is Joevin Dolla. I'm the senior managingeditor over at outreach, and today we are joined once again by Dan Gottliebover at Topo. He's an analyst specializing in sales development and this is aninteresting one. Today we're going to talk about chat. What's IT doing forsales? Where's it going, all those fun things. But before we dothat, on the toss of down over to day and for those of youwho don't know him, then give us a little intro and a little bitabout your background. Yeah, it's great show. Thanks. What really happento be back today? So, Dan Gottlieb, I am an analyst atTopo and the sales development practice. We're research and advisory firm WHO specializes insales development, count base marketing and sales effectiveness. You know, I've beenat Topboo for a while. I get a really exciting job. I getto partner with and study the some some of the highest, fastest growing companiesand try to understand and unpack the patterns and plays that they're adopting that areleading to revenue efficiency and specifically how that relates to sales development. Some kindof a geek about this stuff, and you know, before that I wasI was doing some similar work on my own and before that I was doingsome similar work but for a few high...

...growth companies based out of Brooklyn,New York. Now I'm in the Bay and I'm really excited to be hereon the show today. Awesome, we're excited to have you. Let's justjump right in chat right. We're talking about the little window of the POPsup while you're on someone's website and you talking to somebody and it goes backand forth. Not Anything particularly new. I mean I feel like I chattedwith live nation or ticket fly like ten years ago trying to get aerosmith tickets. But why is it so revolutionary. Now, why is it changing?Sales man check gets me gone. I'm really excited for it. I thinkthat there is a tremendous amount of potential in chat and there's a couple reasonswhy. The first reason is it's the immediacy of it. It's the oppositeof a cold call. Right it is the exact opposite of a cold call. I, as a buyer, can go to a website and I canengage in a conversation with a company that I want to learn more about,ask only the questions that I want to ask, expect only the responses thatI'm looking for. I can immediately exit the conversation as quickly as I wantand right I have immediate access to human being. If I want to continueto go further, it's better than any kind of lead form because of theway that I can immediately engage. Right I get to a website. IfI want to learn about your website, I want to talk to somebody,I got to go. I got a fellow lead form, I got towait for someone to call me back. Then I could schedule a meeting andthen I get a phone call right in. In some cases I might immediately geta phone call as soon as I said, fell out the lead form, but then I'm stuck on the phone and I got to have a funconversation with someone that I wasn't exactly expecting that day. All the considered,if I've got some specific questions, I can get them answered, but I'mnot just getting them answered by a support person. Because of the routing technology, I can get them supported by the person who has the maximum interest inhaving me those questions answered from me, the Rep that in charge of supportingmy territory, in charge of supporting my...

...account. So that immediate connection isthe first and most important reason for why it's so exciting because of the dynamicthat someone that's so interested can mediately get the responses that they're looking for.The second dynamic is more of a human dynamic. Right, if you thinkabout where a lot of your conversations are happening at work today, I'm lookingat the piece of software where I have a lot of conversations with my colleagues. It's a chat one. Right, if you think about slack, slackis revolutionizing the way we communicate. What it's doing is is conditioning us tohave really important conversations and collect information of over chat. And so today,what chat is is a comfortable channel that aligns directly to the same way I'mcommunicating internally at my company, and that is super important if I'm selling tosomebody that's at a lower level at a company. If you're thirty years old, you grew up using a well instant messenger to build relationships in middle school, right. Those are people that are making business decisions today, and that'simportant to understand that chat is so much more comfortable today than it ever hasbeen before in our everyday life, and that's, I think, why,coupled with the immediacy and the routing potential, is why chat is really having thisis having this this limelight moment. Hit me up on AI. AmCaptain De teague. What was your screen name? Joe Captain Fatigue. CaptainFatigue bind was this guy thinks as yeah, it's crazy, though, but you'reright. We've been conditioned for the past twenty odd years to communicate throughchat, but I want to go back to use it. You said somethingabout the human element, right, that you feel like you're conversing back andforth with the real person, and this is a way that we're used tocommunicating with people. What about that fine...

...line where some company do you usebots as their front, First Line of Defense? Right, that the firsttime that you're you're connecting with the chat window, you're not talking to aperson, you're talking to a Bot. Yeah, you, if you knowthat, that can be off putting. So how do you navigate that?Great Question. I think that how different our bots from a lead form,other than they're a little bit more interactive. Right. I think bots can bereally intelligent, especially if you have a really high volume of inbound leadsand helping you route people to the appropriate area. It can also be reallyhelpful because you're still getting the user experience of immediacy with a chat tool.But if you're a customer and you have issues right, or if you area if you're just going to submit information, all right, chat can be superhelpful as just a way to process all of that traffic and just providesanother option for someone to engage with your company. Right in that they're justnot that different. It's a bought is not that different from a lead form, other than it's a little more dynamic. You could it can have a conversationwith somebody if they want to write and the idea that it's off puttingis it would be no different as if they just get to your website andthere is no chat. They can go look at other things on your websitethat don't have to engage in a Bot. Right. In fact, that's whata lot of us do when we get to a website where the spot. Additionally, it's important understand that and be to be we're seeing a lotof effective chat only be placed on super high intent pages. So I'm onlyto get chat when I go to pricing or I got a demo or solutionsright, or if I go somewhere on a website where it makes sense forthat chat to come up. We're seeing that as be emerging as a bestpractice, as opposed to just put chat everywhere. Then it will become anotherscreaming channel on that website. So it's it's valid that there's, you know, the Consto concerns around Bots, but ultimately I think that bots can bea really good thing for both the customer and the prospect, excuse me,both the prospect and and you, the...

...the company, if they are theplay books that are in them are designed to really understand the reasons why peopleare coming to the website. I love the fact that you mentioned only placingthe chat windows on high intent pages, because I think that's something a lotof companies, while they should be thinking about it, maybe don't, because, anecdotally, I go to home pages all the time and boom, I'mhit up with the chat bought right away a and I what do I do? Immediately x out of it right and then, and then I'm never goingto open it again, even if I do get to a high intent pagewhere I am looking at pricing or I am thinking about requesting a demo.That that's a fantastic takeaway for people listening today is that, hey, ifyou're going to implement one of these things, you should definitely think about where youwant to implement these things. Yeah, you're absolutely right. I have afriend WHO's building a small he's mobile application in the firefighting tech business.Interesting he and his business partners have built their entire business based on chat.They receive all of their inbounding quiries through chat. They immediately place those individualsinto a automated sequence of emails through that Chat Technology and those those automated toolsare designed to drive free trial sign ups of their mobile APP and then,once in a free trial, continue to drive more engagement on things that theycan accomplish through that free trial and using that tool. They also engage inchats about the deals and they actually do the contracts through the chat right,and so they've built I mean we're talking two thousand transactions, which is,you know, sizeable amount of money for a for a firehouse, right,and those the entire business is being built through through chat. But what's interestingabout that is that chat is just one dynamic. It's that they're also directlyrelating that into the email automation right from... to email automation. Is aimportant transition to discuss and talk about. I mean we are here on thesales engagement podcast and well, that that does present an interesting discussion and Ithink, potential showdown between chat and sales engagement in the very near future.Right. Well, let's talk about it. We're on the show. When youthink the showdown is going to happen? Why does it have to be ashowdown? Why can't it be a partnership? Let's let's has this out. I agree. I think you're right. I mean, why is it ashowdown because I I'm trying to make a decision between a chat technology right, and I've already got a sales engagement technology. I'm saying I don't Idon't need the email piece. I already got the email piece. I onlyneed the chat piece. Right. Well, you can come over to us andwe've got the chat piece. Okay. Well, if chat develops voice andchat has voice, chat and email in the same platform, how adifferent are we really from sales engagement? If you think about sales engagement,what do we got going on? We got voice, we got email.All we're missing this chat. I think that it's really going to depend onthe players in the space and write. What kind of investments do they wantto make? Ultimately, I think that they all should be under the sameumbrella, because what the REP needs is a tool to execute and manage allthose channels. Right, chat is I'm going is emerging as a mandatory channelin sales engagement, because I if I'm not doing it, my competitors are. And if I have a person that's actively in a buying cycle that perceiveschat service for someone that doesn't, right, am I setting myself up on myautomatically behind, and because of that and the hypoth this and the thenotion that the rep should be executing their task from the same pain of glass, it's only logical for chat and sales engagement to merge in the in thenear future in order for in service of the end user and the customer.Okay, let's let's pull out the crystal ball. Let's look into the future. The two services have merged. Where...

...does chat fall within a prescribed sequenceof touch points or touch patterns? Is it right only at the top,we're essentially replacing the lead capture form, or is it sprinkled throughout? GreatQuestion. It's a really good question. I think the first thing it's goingto do is it's going to be focused primarily on inbound right. So theinbound suite for the inbound a star that sits on that side of the roomand the outbound suite for the outbound SDR in this side of the room aredifferent right in terms of the the tools that I'm using, the way I'mthinking about my day, and chat is as a shining example of that.I think that that's one thing to understand, is that it's going to first focuson inbound, potentially replacing lean forms. But the second area, which isreally an interesting thing that you bring up, is the potential for engaging, we at chat in later stages of a sales cycle. Let's talk aboutthat for a second. What that means is that a sales rep is engagingin chat with their prospect later in a sale cycle. Why is that possible? Because that's already happening today, but it's happening here on my smartphone.It's known that you know you're not going to close a deal if you're nottexting with your prospect right, if you're not constantly engaged SMS discussion with yourprospect throughout a sale cycle, you know the probability that deal coming in ismuch lower you're not having some of those intimate conversations or you're not having thosequick back and forth around. Where you at right? How's it going?Relationship to being built through SMS, text messaging or I message, and soit makes perfect sense for that to just be moved over into the chat functionalityof the sales engagement. Why would companies like that? Because they can capturethat. I can't capture SMS communications and understand the dynamics of that and studythe patterns. Right, I can't do...

...that today. And if you wantto know, right, what are the what are the best tactics of highperformers, then late stages, I guarantee you almost every single one of themis texting with their prospects. And so if I can bring that under salesengagement, that's something that a sales and revenue leader would really want to careabout. So are you saying that in future people will transition off of textingand just be doing chat within a sales engagement platform? Or do they servedifferent purposes? Right, because I'm imagining let's say a prospect is engaged withan account executive. The prospect returns to the site to check on something right, check on pricing one more time, or to download a white paper.Boom that a gets an alert saying hey, your prospect on the site right now. Chat window opens, because that's kind of what I'm thinking. Andthen texting plays a different role, maybe like negotiations and whatnot. But buthow do you see these two living harmoniustly or harmoniously or not? Yeah,I mean, look, there's a there's a natural human element here. Ilike to text because it's not being recorded and it's it's a channel that Icontrol and it's a very personal channel and it's the same channel you used tocommunicate with people you care a lot about in your life, and so thatlevel of familiarity is are are they harmonious? I think that they can serve apurpose. I think that it's possible for the chat channel to exist asanother way to engage. Right. I also think it's possible for someone deepin a sales cycle to say reach out to each out to joe over chat. You those are good questions, let's chat him into this meeting right now. Right. I think that it's just the immediacy of that channel is thatis what allows it to be have a role in in a later stage salescycle. Right. It's very realistic, and this is happens a lot indeals, where your champion is in a meeting with the decision maker, asa couple other people involved, and they're talking about your solution. They havequestions that they need your help with and sometimes the champion will say, Oh, I'll get that, I'll go get the answers and get back to him. Other Times you might get a text.

It's Ay, you available right now, right, or you get an email, you available right now.You just get chat. It's the same thing. That's all. Okay,let's go back to the crystal ball. Now live in a world where chatis very commonplace with within BB sales. Okay, what's after that? What'sthe next thing? Because it's just going to keep evolving. Yeah, Iwas just thinking about how funny would be to send your prospects a snap rightthese head next. I don't know what's next after chat. I think what'sgoing to be next after chat. This is a big hairy prediction around salesengagement. I think what we're going to be able to do is that we'regoing to be able to take some of our recorded tech, we're going tobe able to have the natural language processing tools that are inside of our conversationalintelligence, that it's inside of our studying the messaging today, and we're goingto be able to automate the content that we follow up with. Right,I'm going to be able to take our conversation right and have a deck that'sproduced right out of it. That says here the top three takeaways, becauseat the very end of the call I said here the top three takeaways.I could have just said, okay, Google, here the top three takeaways, right, and all of a sudden they automated natural language processing. Willtake my deck right and we'll take my voice, will take my takeawayz processthem, try to make sense of them and auto produce my content in myfollow up deliverables. I don't think that that's that crazy. As a what'snext after chat is the automated deliverable content that we create in service of thesale cycle. I don't think that's crazy at all and I want that rightnow. That's incredible and yeah, I think you're one hundred percent right.That can't be that far off right, and that is kind of the nextevolution, because an LP is everywhere right now and it's just kind of nowtaking that that processing power and having it creates something on next step. Sothat's that's amazing. Yeah, Oh God, it's so exciting. You look atthe you look at a lot of where the big investments are see sales force putting a ton of... into voice. You See Alexa. I mean we see what's happening in our consumer lives. We don't evenneed to go into that right but you see this. These the steep investmentsin voice and the potential for what you do after that. I think that'swhere what's next after after chat? Awesome prediction and I hope you're right becauseI really want to live in that world. Dan. If people aren't on instantmessenger anymore, how can they get a hold of it? Linkedin?Linkedin Dan got leave the Topo, or my email dress for social d lastname, got leave at Topo hqcom. Those would be two great channels toget in touch with me. I don't have chat set up yet, butif you go to our website you can use chat to talk to someone onour team if you guys are interested in our services. But CHAMEL's plod right. I guess I had to do that anyways. Yeah, that would bethe best way to get ahold of me. Not Shame was it's okay, youwere at the end of the podcast. This is where that's that's for allright, Dan's are much for being on the episode. I really appreciateit. Thanks again to all of our listeners for tuning in today and wewill see you next time on the sales engagement podcast. Thanks looks. ThanksJoe. This was another episode of the sales engagement podcast. Join US atsales engagementcom for new episodes, resources and the book on sales engagement coming soon. To get the most out of your sales engagement strategy, make sure tocheck out outreach dioh, the leading sales engagement platform. See you on thenext episode.

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