The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 4 months ago

Sales Managers: Quit Cheerleading! w/ Shawn Buxton

ABOUT THIS EPISODE


One of the biggest myths about sales leadership is that leaders have to be cheerleaders. What should a sales leader’s job be?

That’s what I chatted about with Shawn Buxton, Sr Manager of Sales Leadership Enablement at LogMeIn.

What we talked about:

  • Why sales managers should forget cheerleading
  • The 4 main sources of motivation
  • Creating a culture of motivation

For more engaging sales conversations, subscribe to The Sales Engagement Podcast on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or on our website.

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Welcome to the sales engagement, apodcast, this podcast is brought you by outreach, the leading sales engagementplatform and they just launched out reach on our reach the police. To learnhow outreach well does not reach learn how the team follows up with every leadin record time after virtual events and turns them into revenue. You can alsosee how out rectins account based plays, manages reps and so much more usingtheir own sales engagement platform. Everything is backed by data pulledfrom out reach processes and customer base when you're done you'll be able todo it as good as they do, and to outreach down io son out reach to seewhat they have going on now, let's get into the day's episode hello and welcome back at one to thesales engagement podcast. Thank you for lending us, your ear drums for the nextthirty minutes, or so we help to be worthy of those. Your drums, it's goingto be a fun conversation I am joined by Sean Buxton, can is actually the seniormanager of sales leadership enablement. So I've definitely heard of you know:Sales enablement roles. This idea of sales, leadership and Nablin is superinteresting, and that was part of the reason I really wanted to to get shownon at such a successful, fast growing company log me- and many of us haveprobably heard of it if you're in the tech ecosystem, but son welcome so muchto the show. Thanks for Ames got very excited to join you today to geek outon some sales leadership stuff. Let's do it, man, I'm a self proclaimed salesand marketing nerd. So I love this time said Ed to chop it up with you. Butfirst I like to sort of set the stage. You know the listeners don't know whereSean Buxton came from. I don't know the full full story. I would love to hearthat the Superhero origin story of a how you got to such a cool, fast boringcompany and how this kind of position...

...came about. What led you to to get inthere yeah great well. I've been in either teaching sales selling myself orleading a sales team for over twenty years. So I've been doing it for alittle bit and Loman approached me and said they were creating this new rolebecause leadership development in their sales organization and become a realpriority for them, and so we started spending a little time getting to knoweach other and one thing like to the next and before I knew it, I wasaccepting offer to join the team, and you know I thought it was veryinteresting because believe it or not. There's not that many rules, like therole that I have, even though, if you think about it, it makes a lot of sense,because we spend a lot of time, training our sales people and we spenda lot of time, training them how to sell and how to present the product inthe right way into problem solve and all these things. Yet we've spent verylittle time in training the sales management team tofollow through on all that training and I'm sure, you're well aware that youknow training is just the beginning of the conversation just to be in adiscussion. I wish I had a magic wand where, if he came to one of my sessions,I could just like tap you on the head. I need to be a master at halingobjections or master coach or whatever we're talking about that day, butthat's not what happens, and what I found is that the manager takes thatball and then runs with it. But as you're also aware, I'm sure a lot ofour managers came from a former sales background. They were just hyperforming reps and especially the smaller you go in the company, the more commonit is to see them just take their top performing rep when they get over, likemaybe ten or so raps they take that top performing rap. They make them themanager, and while that person may a been a great rap and have a lot of bestpractices, they can sure the team. It's not necessarily the same set of skillsto lead a team, especially to new...

...levels of performance, and so what Ireally liked about log me an was, they were saying: Hey. This is a priorityfor us. We see the gap here and it's a real competitive advantage for usagainst our competitors to say: Hey, we have someone solely dedicated tobuilding hypertensive and educating them on how to build a sustained highperformance team, and so that's what I do every day and I love doing it. It'svery rewarding I get to work with some of the best sells eaters on the planet.I say at long men and also do some consulting on the sides I get to. Theyallow me to spread my lings a little bit as long as it's not a competitor.You know, and so it's a really great role for me. That's awesome. I feel like you're right. This is not a very, verycommon role, although I should be- and I think one of the course of the nextfew years will see more rules like this emerge, whether it's focused purely onsales, leadership, marketing leadership, even maybe revenue leadership as awhole, because you're so right so so many times it's the top performer getsa promotion and then all of a sudden, once you're, like manager or directorlevel, you're supposed to have it all, figured out it. The sick, okay, you'reyou're, the one teaching you're supposed to know and many times peoplecan be in their their first leadership role. Sometimes it comes more naturallyto some folks than it is to other people. People have very degrees ofpeople management through their life, whether it's you know sports, whetherit's music, whatever it is. So that's that's super interesting and I'mexcited to dive really into kind of some of the areas of focus there. Also,what makes a good leader a lot of different areas we can. We can focus on,but let's quickly take a step back, so thousand twenty plus years of ofexperience by canses guitars. In the back, you alluded to the fact you're,actually a touring musician. I think...

...it's super important to quickly gothrough kind of t e. The career artistry think that I think a Sallespeople. We all have such unique pats that broad us here and some of US fallinto it. Some of US get here and all sorts of Wini pass so at it's alwaysinteresting to hear how people got to where there they're at what's kind ofthe the brief story are well without boring your audience to tears. Igraduated from college and I actually was a worship pastor, so I led I ledmusic at the church and I discovered very quickly that, while I enjoyedbeing in the church and playing music at the Church and working with thosepeople that that's not where I want to get my pay check, and so I thought whatcan I like? WHAT SKILLS DO? I have that I can transition over into corporateAmerica, where I can make some real money and still use some of the skillsthat God gave me, and so the one I kept coming back to me was just the abilityof communicating to teach and even at the time as a pastor as a youth pastor,especially, I was constantly selling people to come help me for free andthen I would sell other people and changing their whole lifestyle forsomething that they couldn't see or touch or feel or here, and so I waslike man. Maybe I may it be good as a sales guy. I don't know, and so I endup looking up with a JAP Morgan as a sales rap and spend a little bit oftime selling. There did pretty well and they approached me and they said Hey.You know we have this kind of part time training thing where you're half time asalesperson, half time a trainer where you can teach other reps, what you'redoing that's making you so good at your job and do you think you'd be interestin something like that was like Hell Yeah? I'm really excited to talk topeople and to teach them and to share that with them, and that was kind ofthe beginning of my train career, of course. After that, I transitionedfully into a training role, but throughout the years about every threeto five years, or so I will take time off and go back to just being anindividual contributor to keep it real...

...to stay in touch to keep my skill sharp,because one of the things I really like to emphasize with the sales managers is,you know you have to be able to execute the things that you're talking like youhave to do it and the best way to sell your team on your leadership is to juststep up and get on the phone, and do it not to do it for them, but to show themthat you can do and to build their competence in you and then they willthen in turn, accept your inside in your coach and he'll be much more aptto accept that, and so I love to go back and say I still sell now as aconsultant, but also enjoy that training and just helping peopleconnect the dots on, say wow. This is, this is like something: that's workedfor a lot of people and it could work for me and I've been really puzzledabout how to get over this obstacle, and so I really enjoy watching thatlight. Go off so that's kind of it in that show I've just toggled back andforth between selling or teaching sales from the last you know, like I saidtwenty years, I hate to keep emphasizing that because it makes mesound old, but it's the truth. That's that's awesome. So I really like thatapproach. Hey go go on these like teaching sprees,but then also go sharpen the axe and go back like do the role. That's such agreat way to look at it so that you're, not just teaching theory. I know Iliterally like just did this stuff and I think that's where a lot of trainingsystems even trainers like fall down, because it's okay, I get it. Whatyou're saying, but you haven't done this for ten fifteen years and timeshave changed particularly in this time. We're all in now were like the pace ofevolution and advance frame is just insane. So the sales landscape isdifferent, like even in six months from now, it's going to be totally different.So I really love that approach. How do you adopt or teach almost that personalapproach, or how do you entertwine that...

...thinking with some of the leaders thatyou coach right like do you suggest them doing some sort of like form ofthat, like it's not possible for all of them? You know a director to get thenice all the time, but how do you kind of coach, the leaders that you workwith to make sure that they do have a good finger on the pulse, because Ithink you're right leading from the front, is arguably the only way to doit. Well, a lot of times you can't jump onthe phone, or does it make sense? Oh Er, it gives us a customer the wrongimpression if you jump on the phone as a manger kind of De deflates, the wrapa little bitter or yeah yeah, knocks them down and notch in the eyes of acustomer. But what you can do is you can be role playing. You can bemodeling. The way in team meetings in your coaching sessions, you know, don'tjust say, hey well, you need to ask better questions. You will freakingshow him how to ask a great question with that looks like show them how tohandle objection. Stay be willing to say to your reps a give me the worstobjection, you're hern right now, they're, like Oh man, it's always priceor price, is too high. All we tried you before and you really screwed up ouraccount. We don't you know, we don't want to come back to you again, let'sroll through that, let's handle that objection and I'll be the rap. You bethe customer and let's go like there. I just post a video on tick tock talkingabout this, like that. That is really the only way to show people that thatyou're capable and what that does. Is that builds trust in your leadership. Imean, like imagine, imagine like an athletic coach like if you think oflike the Tampa Ay, buccaneers or Liverpool football team across the pond.There imagine if their coaches just walked on the field and had I like zeroknowledge of the game or zero experience or zero background, and theyjust totally relied on the players like come up with the answers. Well, whywould why do we even need a coach then like? Why do we need somebody on thefield if they can't give me some kind of insight beyond what I have and basedon their experience m yeah very true,...

...and I like that, getting yourself intothose worldly scenarios, it's more like show me, don't teach me kind of thingyeah, which I really really like switching hears a little bit. What doyou see as some of the the lesser known leadership, qualities that some ofthese new managers that just come up, maybe don't identify right away? Oh Man I'll try to keep it short, but I kindof like to approach it as like. I try to tackle manager, myths, yeah, sosales manger myths and these these myths. They come from like just thesegarbage articles on linked in they're. Just so generic and there's just peopleclassing out a content just to to get likes and and it's very low hangingfruit, but the problem is like young managers and even you know, seasonmanagers read this stuff and they think that this is like the way to do it andlike the tropes, like the you know, people don't leave their company, theyleave their manager like. We all know that at this point like that, thatstuff is like twenty thirty years old and so the fresh stuff, I think, isreally in looking at everything with a new set of eyes and saying: Is thisstill real? This is still applicable, or is this more like a sales managermyth so that you know one that that I like to talk about with my maninterests. A lot is this concept of motivation and it's one of the mostguilty culprits on online people. Talking about motivation, the approachI take with my managers. As I say, I challenge them. The manager myth thatthat's their job to motivate their sales team. I don't believe it is. Infact, I don't believe that they've ever done it I'll have some sales managers.Tell me no. It is my job and you'll hear directors and bps like kick offand things like that saying. You know we're here to motivate you and, and Ikind of cringe when I hear that, because I think the main thing that I'mproud of in my personal life and in my professional life and tell me if I'mway off base in regards like your...

...experience as well, but I think aboutthe things that I'm most proud of my achievements and I didn't have amanager motivate me to do that. It was a result of my own self motivation thatI did that like the stuff that I'm not that proud of. Maybe somebody got mehyped up for a day or a couple days to do that, but the stuff that I reallytake pride in, like whether it's like graduating from college or landing amillion dollar deal or you know winning the State Championship whatever. It is,the things that were really most proud of in our lives. They were things thatwe only accomplished because we looked inside of us and found the our owninternal self motivation. Yeah managers spend all this time and energy andResources on trying to get their teams pumped up to do a job that, frankly,were already paying them to do that anyway, like that was kind of like thebare minime expectation, when I hired you was that you're going to come towork every day and do your best m, Miss Rapp right, like that, was the deal.What you told me owre going to do. The interview told me you're going to crush,I didn't realize I had to be like a profession, Al Chiller and get youhiked every day to get on the phones, and I shouldn't have to guess what itdoesn't freaking work anyway. All it does is frustrate to you and makes yousee me as a micro manager, and it frustrates to me because I'm notgetting the results for me. So this whole idea of my job as a managers tomotivate my team that to me as a myth, and so what I actually teach mymanagers is. I teach them to never motivate, like don't freaking waste,your time, trying to move motivate your team, because you can't instead spendyour time and effort and energy creating an environment in a team, aculture where self motivation is expected. It's incentive, it's it'sjust recognized every single day and you bring your own self motivation. Thestarts in the interview process telling people that this is the way it is on myteam, you bring your own self motivation, I'm going to give you thetools and resources, the support you need to succeed and you're going to beable to plug it into this awesome culture that I created and I'm going tosupport you remove off schools for you along the way. So I think to me, that'skind of like the foundation of a high performance team is recognizing thatI'm not going to motivate you that you...

...got to come to work every day with youraim with your a game. I'm going to facilitate your success, though yeah Ilike it so in trition call like intrinsic motivation so incrediblyimportant. How is it can be tough to pull that out of some? Like you said,it's borderline impossible right. How do you go about creating that culture?What are some of the like? The tactical steps that you can do to try andincrease intrinsical motivation in the individual raps on your team? Iwouldn't even use the word to increase, I would just say I would I'm trying tohelp them connect with their own internal sources of South Moneday yea.So for me it does start. It starts in the interview process, setting theexpectation that this is not going to be like a regular sales job. In theregard that I'm not going to get you hyped every day, that's fun! You nowdoesn't mean I'm going to come in, be a jackass and like to motivate you allthe time, but it does mean that you have to bring your own self motivation,and so I'm asking them even in the interview process. What are some thingsthat motivate you? Basically, why do you come to ward? Why do you have a joblike we're, not building houses for the homeless? Here probably we're here tomake money. So why do you need to make money? Even? Why is that important toyou? Well, because I I basically breaks down to four categories: it's eitherfear I got to pay the bills, I'm afraid I won't be able to do that. It'sfortune, I, like you, know I, like nice stuff, like I like a nice watch or Ilike a nice car or House, fear fortune fame. I like the recognition of beingthe best one or be to know on the best for philosophy the way I was raised ormy upbringing, my religion, my internal code. The way I see the world demandsthat I do my very best every single day, and so then we attach those internalsources of self motivation to a goal and after I've hired that person, thenin one of longs I would sit down with them and say: okay, Scott, like yousaid that fortune is one of the things that's motivating you right now,because it will change in seasons.

Forte is one of the things that'smotivating right now. You said you want to buy a second house like a vacationhouse on the beach. How much are you going to need for down payment? What doyou think it's going to cost you be like it's Goin to be like fifty grandor something okay, and then we start putting together a plan o sis to be hit. Go My company, my team,our products and services as the vehicle. How can we get you there?What's it going to take and then that that's what drives our discussions? Sowhen you get be motivated, which you will because you're a human being, it'sgoing to happen and you start losing focus, I'm like hey, do come on.Remember we're half way to your beachhead focus. You said you wantedthis. When you don't Really Want My coaching, I can remind you, hey dude,we're working together, I'm your partner, I'm coming beside you to helpyou to chee this goal. That's really how I get people to start being intouch with their internal sources, myself, motivation, and I remind themtoo like when they start reading. I need to be motivating like no dude.That's that's not what I do. I can't do that think about any salescontest. With the little things we do as sales leaders to get people hiked up.Those things are all finding good, but we expect way too much out of them. Weexpect them to create, like these super high levels of perforce, that we'regoing to break sales records because you know someone's going to get a gascart gets absurd when you think about it right or you they're going to getlike some ober, you know eat some bucks or some shit like that. It's very it'svery ludicrous when you think about it, especially in tech. We're talking aboutbig dollar deals, so it's really about getting people in touch with that, andif you want to do that stuff for recognition after the performance tosay. Thank you I'm all about it, but I don't expect that stuff to driveperformance and he use to come from with them, though yeah that's great. Iremit reminds me kind of the the Simon cynic start with with why which is soincredibly important, so so that was interesting. So there's those kind ofin your eyes, like four drivers, there's fear fortune, fame andphilosophy. I would agree with that. Is...

...there one in your opinion that outperforms the rest like if you're driven by philosophy is a better indicator ofsuccess than fame? For example, have you you lean towards one? If you wantto talk about what's more the most powerful that I've seen that I'veobserved and that's beauty is like as people listen to this? The good news isthese aren't just things I like jumped up in my bathtub one night. This isbased off of me, working with top performance sales leaders for twentyyears and really observing them and and saving their best practices to sharewith you. So that being said, the ones that I've seen that are most effectiveor fear and philosophy, but you think about fear. Like I got to pay my bills,you can see people do some crazy stuff when they got to pay their bills. Yeahright, like they'll, go they'll. Make two hundred calls that day instead ofthe hundred because they got to pay the bills versus you know. Philosophy isgreat because that gets to the heart of like who people really are like theirupbringing and a lot of times the philosophy and how they see like by thetime we get them. That's already in stone. It is what it is. So I don'texpect to change that much it's either there or it isn't there and if it isn'tthere, then I'm hoping that they're afraid of not paying some bills. Youknow it's just like when they talk about the wolf of Wall Street is like.I want you guys to go in to freaking debt, because I want you to be scared,because that's when people move right, if it's not a lephil makeup, peoplemove when they're scared and I'm not trying I'm not talking about us,scaring them yeah a silly there's, I'm talking like they have things in theirlife that are driving them, yeah, yeah. So, okay, that's that's cool! So forour philosophy that the two top drivers that you've seen is there a way likehave you found since it? Those are the top two. Obviously don't want O use,fer s a lever- that's that's an awful mean thing to do, but can you almost indoctor someone in a philosophy that's going to help them or again? Is thatsomething that kind of has to be...

...figured out on their own? I think thatyou can establish the culture of high performance and of excellence like astandard of excellence on your team, and people will become uncomfortable ifthey're not aligned with that, so that doesn't make them a bad person. It just might mean thatthis isn't the right team for them that they need to go beyond a team. I getthe competition that she's going to be excited about hitting quota every month,whereas if you're on my team, I want to quota is just like this starting linelike I just want to. I want to start a quota, but then, after we hit quota acouple times now we're talking about a hundred and twenty five percent hundredfifty percent like new goals. So I don't know if that answers yourquestion, but definitely I'm not suggesting even with the fear thing,I'm just saying. If somebody has to pay the rent yeah, you can as a managerhelp them connect with that, but something can scare them, but when theyget unfocused, which they will they will get lazy. We all do that when thathappened say hey man, you know I want to make sure you keep your nice, yournice apartment. I want to make sure you can make that that car payment. Whatcan we do to close this deal over here or connectwith this this client? Or what have you? Yet? It's really, I think it's anexpectation if there, the philosophy is not already there. It's really hard tocreate that, because that comes from like your your upbringing, but you canmake people feel a certain social pressure, because the expectation, theteam, if I go to championship football team and I'm the one that keepsfumbling the ball, I'm going to start to feel some pressure and I'll eitherrise to the occasion or I'll retreat from the responsibility. That's why? Idon't you know another sales manager. Myth is Oh, I shouldn't pressure mypeople because they'll quit well, if they quit, because a pressure could seeyou later, I'm glad that you're leaving, because I know that I'm not pressuringyou without giving you the support you need. I call pressure like I'mchallenging you to be as awesome as I know you can be, and if I go tochampionship team, which that's what I run is I'll run a championship team, Idon't want to run a team. That's just looking to hit five hundred.

If this is a championship team, I thinkpeople will feel uncomfortable that are interested in being champions andthat's. Okay, yeah. I love that that way of thinking.What's the what the line pressure is a privilege Ireally like that want to be in a pressure environment that means you'reworking collectively to this common big, almost unattainable goal, and that is aprivilege to get to get to do yeah. I like it okay, so we talked to like someof these. These manager myths very like people oriented in my mind, there'skind of like two other buckets of enavant, there's kind of like process.You know how are you you creating process to make sure that there's aconstant feedback, loop of growth and then the third one being liketechnology? How can you enable this this same stuff that we used to do inoffice? To now do distribute it? Can you talk through kind of those to twobuckets of how you how you think about process when it comes to your nevermindprograms and then technology, if you're, using in yeah? Absolutely so with withprocess? For me, I try not to over complicate things mates, because I'mnot very smart. I don't know what, but I try to simplify things for myself, soI was just talking to somebody. The otherday and they were saying that they don't really like corporate trainingbecause they think it's hype like they think it's just somebody coming in toour point earlier. They don't know what they're talking about, and I said youknow what there's really only two reasons that that somebody says thetraining doesn't work. There's only two reasons: it's not going to work numberone. You could be right, it could be total, bullshit and and sorry I don'tknow if we were allowed to see a good yeast, okay, correct all right, allright, so I can be to it could be total bullshit and it's just flotan. It isgarbage and it is a waste of very base time that happens every day all day incompanies all over the world from training departments. Admittedly so sonumber one it could be. You could be...

...right that it is a waste. Your timedoesn't work. The second reason that that training is not going to work. Ifit's not bullshit is that somebody is not going to fall through on it. So to me, process is always aboutfollow through, and what do I mean by that I mean senior leadership is notgoing to fall through or the managers are a going to fall.Let's say I send my my team to sales training right with one of our greatsells trainers. I send a team to sills training as a senior leader and they goto sales training if, after the sales training, the manager is not coachingto those sales principles and those sale skills using the language, lettingthose principles really take root, then it's nothing's going to happen.Nothing's going to be different. It was a waste of everybody's time becausethere's no fall through also. If, for example, I send my managers to a salesleadership training, but as a director or a VP, I don't fall through, Hey, I'mso busy. I don't even freaking show up to the training to even know what thehell you're talking about Buxton, and so how can I even coach to that? Howcan I follow through and help and this take route? That is a total waste oftime as well, and the training is not going to work. I don't know what thenumber is, but I would say that that happens a lot more than we believe where people go to training and thetraining was good, but there's no fall through. So nothing happens. Her go thetrainings a waste of time. So for me process, what's paramount about processis follow through we can put together whatever process you want. It'smeaningless meaningless if there's not going to be followed through fromsenior leadership. So that's why I've gotten to where, if there's aninitiative, I don't even I'm not even doing it unless I hear from seniorleadership that they want to do it and then I'm asking them, I'M SAYING:Listen! Is this important to you or not, because here's what people are going tosay? I don't want to do this because this I'm too busy, because of that. Idon't like this. I'm not I've got my own style, Blah Blah Blah. Are yougoing to hold their feet to the fire? I can tell you most of the gans most. Theanswers are yes, but when we go to put it into practice- and you might notrealize this until like a year down the...

...road, they don't have the stomach forthe change m. So it's about fall through with the process. For me, yeah, that's critical, it's like whenyou, you know you read a book and you finisha book and like yeah that was awesome, and then you you, if you don'timmediately start integrating it into your life in a month's time. You'relike Oh, it was a cool book, but I don't. Idon't remember a pig on from from what it was completely gone. Yeah Yeah I like that. Yes, there any, howdo how do you so I love the the tip on, like you know, make sure you know ifyou're building out any sort of an ailment from of training programs. It'slike top down. You need any in from from Cedar Senior Leadership. Whatother ways have you learned to make sure that it's integrated quickly andeffectively after a training? Is it in the language you use?Do you do roll play? This? Is there a way that you're, I don't know liketechnology where you tracking them going through and having them doassignments? What is what does that look like? Well, you know, there's alot of great tools out there right now, like Gong and other tools, I'm sorry ifI'm forgetting your company and you're listening to this and I'm not givingyou this shout out, but there's this great, I a tos that I mean it'sunbelievable. What they can do now and I love them they're amazing, because tome the most valuable coaching is sitting there listening to somebody ona call with them city a crossed, the desk from you or on the call with youvirtually and you guys are listening it together and then then I say at the endof IT Scott. How do you think you did you know? What would you do different?What do you think you crushed in and what could we work on and then youhearing yourself, you know what it's like. I mean it's sopowerful to hear yourself on a call in the things that you'll miss that you'llmiss in real time and think that you just pressed it man and then listenedlatey like Oh, my gosh, I'm so embarrassed that was terrible, so thatkind of technology I think, is...

...incredibly powerful again. Do themanagers have the training, though, to use that technology and then sitdown with you and coach you to it hasn't been instilled it within them byseeing your leadership that this is paramount, that this is a priority todo that coaching or is this running this reporter going to this meetingthey're going over here? Is that what's important? That's where I think thedisconnect happens, and that's why a role like mine and at other companiesthat would have this rule it's so crucial, because the manager has to dothe reinforcement of the training that the reps go through. If you don't, thenit just never takes root, and it doesn't it doesn't matter how great thetechnology is. You know, I would argue, then, that a lot of companies to dayhave too much technology like too many tools, like so many tools, and so manyresources and we've used that as an excuse to not give people one on oneattention and for me, as is from line salesman or not, to coach my people,because Oh we'll go to this. This share page here, go to this launch over here.Go to this shared resource use this tool. You know we just throw more toolsat him and it's almost like a parent with a kid that they don't want tospend the time with that kid they just keep giving them video games or omotation yeah just give em the epet exactly exactly. I wonder you know youknow they wonder why that kid ends up growing up in jail or on the strippingPole, yeah yeah, I mean I call it like youknow like to from it's easy to to go and think that a tool is going to solveyour problem without handling the people and the process. First, awesomeman well that it always goes by, and I see this almost episode every episode.It goes by so fast we're running up against time, but I always like to askthis question: There's a ton of incredible nuggets in there. I wouldurge everyone to go and listen to this one again. There was a lot in therethat that threw at you if people only remember three things from this entireconversation or just three things that...

...are super important to you, that youwant to take the time to highlight what would you want those three things to be?I think I would say number one, never motivated stop wasting your time,trying to motivate people to do a job. Your already paying them to do insteadcreate the environment where people can be self motivated and supported. Numbertwo, I would say, create an intentional culture, so many managers- they justthink of culture- is like the company culture like this big thing up here inthe sky. When there's layers of culture that happened and as a sales leader, Ihad the opportunity to create my own vibe on my team and you and me can beperce and your sales, major I'm stalls, manager and selling the same product orservice can be a totally different Bible on your team versus team box onteam Barker could be totally different, so focus on building and intentional salespoll trend. There's a lot that goes into that. I mean like a lot like. Wespend a whole day just talking about that, and then the last thing I wouldsay is understand the difference between time management and priority management,and what I mean by that is, I refuse I won't do time management training. Idon't do it it's a waste of time, because we all have the same amount oftime of day. It's really about. You need to decide what your priorities areand whatever the priories are. Those are going to get done. First, theproblem with a lot of managers. Is they see their day and they are they misunderstand what the Probert is.So, as a sales leader, there's three things, the top performing salesleaders- I've worked with over the years are always doing their laserfocus on these tree. Things doesn't mean that they don't do other things,but it does mean as soon as they can they get back to doing these freethings. You want to know what they are: Waroona, okay number one building andprotecting your culture, so that's hire and right firing or right. CAFFINEevasion, my Jesum Price, sorry to Kay out are these a teasin priority, or just these arethe three things that should be at the top. This is like in sequence, I think,can not priority they're all priory.

These are your three priorities. Okay,but what happens first is. If I get a brand new team, I want to think what ismy vision for this team who do want to be what's the mission of how what ofthe things we're going to do to get there and then the values? And what wayare we going to do those things, and I want to write that out. I want topresent that to my team and say this is what team Boxton is and then you hireto that and you fire to that, meaning if people are top performers butthey're not living the values that are on team Buxton. That's okay, they're,not a bad person, but I have to be able to have the courage to protect myculture and say you're an okay dude, but you can't work here. You got to gowork somewhere else, because I'm trying to build something great here, I'm nottrying to just build something that I just don't want a bunch of Protocarriers. I want people that are crushing quota. Okay, so that'sbuilding protecting culture. The Second One is coaching. Then Development,coaching then develop not coaching Endo Boland you'll hear the all time, OScott Es coaching and development, no Scott needs coachng or development.Coaching in development. Coaching is getting. People got at their currentjob I in proficient in or not just good enough that we can't farm or thatthey're not on a pip or something but really proficient and good at their job.Development is getting them ready for the next role, so why would I spendtime letting you need a team meeting whenyou're not even hitting your number? Just because you shared with me thatyou want to be a sales manager some day? Well, that's fine! Let's get reallygood the best way for you to be a salesman or some day is to be reallygood at the role that we've been trusted you with right now, so you need coaching there once you'vemastered that role, then we start devoting company resources, includingmy time, to develop you and to give you stretch assignments, get you ready forthe next roll, so it's coaching, then development and then the last thing.The third thing is removing offstage for performance. So the third thing Ishould be laser focused on as a sales leader, is clearing the lane of all thethings that would get in the way of the one objective that my team has, whichis to sell...

...it's not to be customer service agents,it's not to handle billing issues, it's not to fight with ops or commissions orwhoever the product team, and it's none of that it's to sell. So I need to be afilter and a buffer between my team and the rest of the organization andsometimes between the people on my team and solve conflict resolution becausemost of the obstacles we create that we need to overcome on a sales team aremade by poor communication they're created by US having disconnects, andso, if I focus on those three things, building protecting culture, coachingthen development, removing obstacles for performance. I guarantee you, ifyou understand the components, all three of those things that you will bean exceptional sales leader. You will be heads and shoulders above thecompetition, but there's a lot that goes into each one of those things.It's not something I can just you know rattle off in a thirty minute, podcastyeah yeah. I love that. Never motivated create that intentional vibe prioritymanagement over time management. I really like the way of framing that Iagree and have them them focusing on building protecting culture. Coachingthen development also agree. I've never heard it put that way, but you'retotally right. Why are you going to be setting them up for their five yearplan when they're not even crushing it right now? That can just be adistraction at that point and then it's your job to remove obstacles like a man. Well, thank you, you're, anabsolute wealth of knowledge, my friend we probably probably could have gone onand on and on for another hour and a half or show ticking that brain ofyours, but thank you so much for sharing the insect with the listenersand for all those that that joined us.Thank you. I hope you learned, I think or two I know I did and we'll see youagain exeis or thinks Scott. This was another episode of the Sales Engagementpodcast to help this get in front of more eyes and ears. Please leave us ashining five star with yew join us at...

...sales engagement com for new episodes,resources in the book on sales engagement to get the most out of yoursales engagement strategy, make sure to check out out reached out io theleading sales engagement platform. So you on the next episode a.

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