The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 1 year ago

How to Start Creating Multiple Revenue Streams

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Everything gets easier when you put in the hours up front. Whether you're buying real estate, starting a career, or launching a business, things snowball when you invest early.

Do it now. You can't start any younger.

In this episode, I interview Sam Silverman, Vice President of Sales at Prometric, about how to diversify your revenue streams to prepare for the future.

What we talked about:

  • How to scale your investments
  • Getting educated in your subfield
  • When to add employees
  • Three tips for getting started with multiple income streams

For more engaging sales conversations, subscribe to The Sales Engagement Podcast on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or on our website.

Welcome to the sales engagement a podcast. This podcast is brought you by outreach, the leading sales engagement platform, and they just launched outreach on outreach, the place to learn how outreach well does outreach learn how the team follows up with every lead in record time after virtual events and turns them into revenue. You can also see how outreach ones account based, plays, manages reps and so much more using their own sales engagement platform. Everything is backed by data pulled from outreach processes and customer base. When you're done, you'll be able to do it as good as they do. Had to outreach do io on outreach to see what they have going on. Now let's get into today's episode. Hello and welcome everyone to the sales engagement podcast. Thank you, as always, for hanging out with us for the next twenty five thirty minutes or so. It's gonna be an interesting one. We're going to take a little bit of a different approach, a little bit of a different angle today, but I know it will be an interesting discussion and if the listeners are anything like me, their ears are going to park up when they hear the topic. But before we get to that, I want to introduce my guests. I'm joined by Sam Silverman. Sam, welcome in. Yeah, thank God, and it's funny. You know, you and I have to an exting background from the days of outreafecting fire. You coming outreach. I think you're in the first meeting I book as an SCR at outreach from your back with media valet. So it hell, YEA circle. Hell, yeah, that's that is awesome. I didn't actually I haven't actually made that deck connection before. By by Kutas forgetting that. That meeting. And Yeah, of course you spent a great Mantissan earlier on your career at a outreach. Now you've gone on to do some incredible things, man, so Kudos for the career growth. For those listeners, let's maybe start there. What is that Superhero Origin Story of Sam Sobering? Howd you get to where you're actiday? So our reach was definitely a big part of it, right. So myself and a group of, give or take ten folks came over from a smaller company and it's a more space. All came on board. There a lot in the SCR function. A few managers, another's another roles. But really, at the time out re startle out their growth right. They have the you know, Pampa Office. They started hiring and scaling a ton. Great place to learn, the great place to really cut your teeth and kind of get exposed to the whole sales world, get exposed to high growth or work. They have started there. Did my hours for sure, write the first few months I was blocked in office, grinding away and it really paid off big time. Like it was a place that it really put in the work. It paid back in a big way. So from there actually linked up with an old boss prior to coming outreach, where once a lot of person, Bill F SCR or. There from scratch, taking all of those learnings from outreach, built it from zero to forty five people about fifteen months. Globally. So the the global core was definitely a big challenge in terms of the different culture, different people, different markets. You have about a two and a half year run there. Did a lot of great things. And then from their move actually in Bost again to a company called to metric where BPS ls. Here I lead our mid market sales organ all S SR function stuff. Love that man. Quite a journey. A couple solid questions. That are what would be your one piece of advice for folks that are maybe looking. Are just tasks with building out now a global team, whether it's an SCR team or sales team. What was like? One or two your learnings from going global? Fine, time to meet with someone local who understands the cultural differences right away. That was in the stake that I made at first. It is not fully understanding how different people operate. Right. I've had different cultures, what their norms are. Just people really focus on what people care about. Right. Spending time with someone who's local and well respected and...

...life there will help you transition a lot easier. For me, you know, it was almost doing things that I've always done them there and I didn't work at first. Right. There's a big learning curve in terms of you know, a lot of the system and process are very similar, but the people aspect definitely send your time getting connected with someone, have your first internally who can help you navigate that side of it where you're figuring out what these people like, what's the culture like? How you motivate someone? Right, people are very different. Right to understanding that, what do you? First thing, cares about, what they're motivated by, is so important. So that's definitely something that I wish I would have spent a little more time up front and doing. Y A overall, just know your people and know the culture and from there a lot of things, systems and process you know, seventy percent of the things are exactly the same, but the nuances in the market, in the people, or what makes the biggest difference? Great Advice, great advice. And then the last follow up question on the background is what is your advice for people making that transition from leading sales development team to now you're leading sales? What were some of those almost mindset shifts or things that you had to overcome to make that leap? I think one of the biggest things that I'm looking at the Scrro work this thers. I view it as it's a conversion right. It's your output, right, the overall and not of activity, if to do with that's called emails, linkedin social whatever it may be, right, multiplied by your conversion and at first you can bust your ass and really put the output a lot higher to make up for your gaping conversion, whereas in a selling role you can do it to a point, but it's a lot more getting dialed in about a process right, understanding when you put and pull. So then the biggest thing is just you need to come in quickly make an impact for the people on your team to build the respect they have for you, especially being, you know, having a short tenure in certain roles and people on our team that had previously right. So, for example, why that people might team who've been selling for three four times longer than I have right. So it's understanding quickly as how do you get yourself quick win to buy the respect and credibility with the team and then from they're really looking at how you dig any overall help them. Like if your number one goal is how do I come on in your pocket, if your team right, and how do I make things easier for you, you gain a lot of respect really quickly from the orb that you need to get stuffed one right. I think that's the biggest thing is put your team first in terms of their earnings, in terms of what they care about, in terms of making them feels that have a place of comfort and a place they can do well, and I'll all fall in the place from there. I love it. Great Advice. All right, ma'am, let's transition. So what I want to talk about for the bulk of this episode is we can call it side Hustles, we can call it multiple revenue streams. I certainly think from my Lens and the people I'm talking to, that it's more common than ever for employees at companies to have multiple streams of revenue coming in and I think in a future that's constantly changing, I think that's just smart. You know, to diversify. We're told to diverse. Find The stock market. We might as well with our own revenue streams. And I know that you do some a lot of real estate investing and I imagine a lot of our our listeners are maybe at a place where they, you know, hopefully they've had a good quarter, a few good quarters. Maybe you have some extra money lying around, don't know what to do with it, looking at different options. There's the stock market, there's CRYPTO, there's real estate, there's angel investing, there's all these different options and we're going to spend, you know, the next little while just riffing on it. But let's start at the beginning. When did you start going down this path of did it start right with real estate, or were you kind of this crossroads or have some surplus money? What do I do with it? Walk me through. Yeah, yeah, the mine was I grew up in New York City, so real estate there was your only inducting real estate. Right.

You have the perception that it's for the people who have, you know, generational wealth already, where you can have, you know, teertop of dollar thing. But into something and moving to Florida actually helped a lot, right, in terms of getting inspectibility, like okay, you feel all people doing this, tell people getting involved, and on my area it was you start having okay now, making the conchect your income and say all that if you do well, it jumps off a suffic natural role the very, very quickly, right, realizing the complement effect of okay, I'm doing well. Now it's snowballs, snowballs and some from there, like all right, when we get into something, this starts paying me on regular basis. So I bought single family house, bought another and another, another and another and all those bad things. Do you think of real estate? Right, most people. You're not at getting real estate or RELEAS general perception is. You think of tenants, toilets, for my right, all those things that are freaking pain and I think a big thing that is often lost, especially in a career, that most of the listening this are not salaried employees but the base salary. But they make their money and their upside by performing in their role. So, in thinking of the the single family houses, they were a good experience when looking at the headspace. The headspace is not talked about enough in sales, is that by allocating your effort and time and your mind share the things that ultenly aren't worth it. But I've been looking at their turn on your time and your pe couple productivity. It was taking up way too much of my time and head space the return that I was getting. So by a single family house, they cast showing are from two, three four hundred dollars a month. Nothing wrong with that, but when you think of it, you know one pennant leaves after a year, your cash flow for that is gone and your entire mind like it's draining to deal with. Right you're managing toppy managers, you're managing tendance, you're managing renovations at all of the things that take away from your core function, which is if you do well in sales. You are paid very your wealth for it. Yeah, that's that is that balance, right, is you have to look at, okay, where's my main source of income coming in? And then wherever you're expending time, you almost have to give yourself an hourly rate. You know, you like Kay, I'm worth Fivezero an hour, and then you can't really deviate from that too much. And if you're spending these extra calories on these things that aren't generating as much, then your your kind of you are losing, losing out. So when it's so, you start down this road tore like an I'm going to buy all these single family homes. You accumulate quite a few are generating sum returns. Not, not a ton for you. Where did you go after that? Yeah, so I started doing a lot more education, because in anything right, you look at scale, look at how to steal a sail towards kind to scale a company itself, how to scale business, and you have to have more any transactions right, more of anything. There as a sales are be gone from selling, you know, fmb deals, that five, tenzero. It's selling multimillion dollar deals. Right. That progression is where you make your money, how you scale off with with still managing your time and effective the hourly rate. So from there, ton ton of research on different avenues or any commercial rule. If they always pop popped up, because it's the most money you can do in a transaction, it still makes sense, right. So and when I take commercial, specifically multi family properies, what's my focus? So five units and above up. And the big difference there is that these properies are valued like a business. Right, think of your net offering income as your evita and think of your cap right as the inverse of your revenue multiple. So the properties are really valued and you can force appreciation right like say, for example, you know outreach. They double and revenue, their valuation jumps up in a big way. Right. Same with it a multi family of property, where if you can go in there and raise the rent and drive operational efficiency, the value of the property goes up and your from you a fourteen to twenty four...

...s for each dollar that you raise in opering income. So it's very, very tangible to go into the business plan and drive value through there. So in terms of on my end to a lot of research. Right, realize that there's ways to get into fractional ownership of larger properties, right where you're investing a twenty, five, fiftyzero dollars into a larger operation to get a fractional ownership of that property and be part of that business plan, where your entirely handsoff right so on in those experiences and you're writing a check, you're doing your due diligence on the operators or I'm a big believer, and you bet on the people all day long, like hiring, like in investing, and then from there you kind of valuate each deal they bring to you and they steal them. We think of the certain price sales which you'll see some groups to a deal, three a quarter. Then from there you know, not again for two three quarters from there. So the biggest thing that I see these deals is that it allows you to once you do your due diligence. I'm both the sponsor and on the operator in the deal itself, your hands off, which allows you to get back at time of Mancher M. Yeah, and so I'm not overly as I mentioned before, I'm not overly familiar with this world. I'm probably where you were at with your New York their mindset. I live in Vancouber and we were just named, I think, the second least affordable city in the world, other than Hong Kong, just under Hong Kong. Sorry. So I'm in that and it's just like a real estate that will be for another day. You know, let's play around like with companies and stuff to start with. So would that be what's called like a real right? Is that? Is that what you're talking about when you're you're buying these fractional ownerships? So a similar concept? Right, you'll see companies like fun rise and crowdstores who quexibly fool money together. But I think the biggest thing right, is that when you're looking at want of these feels, it's typically each individual deal isn LLC. Right. We have a group of people putting care of that deal, heath and own different core functions, right, whether it be capital raising, do diligence, puppy management, as the management, etc. And you're investing that sacific deal. The biggest Senence I think you have in doing so it's access. Right, you've act just the person's putting together or if you go to one of these the larger crowdsourcing places, you're putting your name you're right. You know you're wiring money and that's it, right. There's no communication, there's no peace of mind there, and the biggest thing you have to have is just the trust in the person and what you're doing. To kind of Hoe back to what you're saying. When looking at living in a market, say Vancouver, New York, parts of California, they're not really infestible and looking at cash flow. Right. So if your goal is to buy your freedom back or to have the financial flexibility to live on your own terms and kind of build that that way so that you can live off the cash blow itself, a market like that doesn't allow you to do that. People have made a lot of money there on appreciation place, but they're not really areas where you can have, you know, consistent income every month or quarter from them. So, when looking at it, gives someone access to deals another areas, right. For example, I've I've holdings in both Borda, Texas, Arizona, Colorado, Idaho, and allows these loose for out in markets similar to how I'm sure you invest, for there's Crypto or stoft in the first sign within different areas. Yeah, yeah, that's that's cool. It sounds like this model that you've moved towards. You don't. You're not hands on at all. So you don't need to be in the city or anything. Question. So to those listening or like, okay, this sounds really cool. What a step one? So clearly you met some some smart people. How did you meet those people? What advice would you give people who are looking to hey, maybe let's get my toes in this? Agree? Sure. So the biggest things that I did was I listen to all different real estate podcast and what you have on there is people going on there. It's like about a...

...topic, but they're really goal is to note the work they're doing and from there you kind of get people. They're like, okay, they seem legit. He seems legit, she seems legit. You can go on there and schedule a call and interview them right, basically interview them and understand. You know what's to look for. How they handle situations right, when something goes bad, how do you handle it right? What's your what's your worst deal? You've done right? What's your communication style? Like an investors? So kind of on May en now, or my focus is is I've invested in fourteen these feels. Personally, and with that I've worked with eight different operators. So I'm doing a Maya and now is looking for folks to coinvest alongside, where I'm actually setting the operators for them. Right, kind of myself being in testimy for it, because I think it's just huge opportunity for people to better understand what goes on in terms of these deals and get them, you know, a secondary ask to investinent outside of the market. But the biggest thing is just trusting who you're investing with and then really setting the operative themselves. Most of the feels you look at, you'll see marginal terms in terms of differences either way. Most profile in the mid to high teams in terms of compounded interest or IRR. So it's really neglible different. It's more so on you trust the person you're giving your capital to and you trust were and Xi an on a business plan. Yeah, and just so I'm clear, because it sounds interesting and certainly after this conversation I'm going to probably pick your brain more and dive into it. So is this then, so in from my world, I recently went down this really cool path with, you know, Max and GTM fund. So I'm learning all about like venture capital and, similar to you, you know, that's what I did. I know a lot of about go to market strategy, I know a lot about startups, but I don't know a lot about valuing companies and all this other stuff that goes into venture capital. But it's incredible what you can learn from podcasts these days and books and like youtube videos. Like within like three weeks I was like okay, I I got the basics. I think you know, if you dive head first. But in VC land often the returns come quite a bit later. Right you're you're making strategic bets on startups that hopefully have some sort of exit event in like five six years. So you're often waiting, you know, and then you get paid out in terms of carrying different things. You can charge or jadmincs as well, but it's deferred in this what we're talking about would real estate. Are you getting monthly parents? I. As soon as you invest in the deal you're getting like monthly returns. So typically what you'll see is the bulk of these deals model for a five year old periods right with the goal is to purchase a value at property, drive up the rent decrease the operating cost. Therefore, you at your right out on your net operat income. It goes up right and you sell that at a certain multiple. So when looking at these deals, to just you just use round numbers. Say You indust a hundred brands, you're likely seeing but eight to ten percent cash flow from you know, about three to six months in right. Typically operators keep some cash on hand at first, but the goal of not doing in capital call right. Say you invested into deal, Scott, and you put in a hundred grand. Like you don't you want to be called six months later. Thanks, Scott, we twentyzero more. So typically see, you know, a six month waiting window to get distributions from the operators. But then you're seeing you your month or quarterly payments, typically eight to ten percent. And how the a lot of these feels work is that you're seeing called eight percent for further return right, basically the every year. You know, that's a hundred grand. You met a hundred grand one time every year getting paid eight thousand dollars broken out monthly or quarterly. And then from there you'll typically see a profit split from the investors to the operating partners called a seventy thirty right. Basically, if you know...

...we raised a hundred thousand dollars for a deal, you know Weke you for three years and then sell it. We know you twenty four Tho dollars off the bat than any less of her proceeds after paying off the debt, all the closing cough, etc. Is Split in a seventy cents to thirty cents ratio. Will typically see a lot of a lot of scenarios like that where you're getting cast flow but you're you're mostly getting your bigger pop at the end upon sale and a five year whole period. If the deal sells quicker, you're seeing your return jump up a lot. The bulk of the value is traded by repositioning the asset then selling it down the road. So if you can sell it and achieve the eggs it sales price earlier, the percentage returns can go from the mid to high teams to well well above that in terms of, you know, condensing the timeline. So I view this as far less risky than looking at angel investing and looking at, you know, potential to go to Marcus Fun. You'll have higher upside in those areas right you're not going to see multiple of twenty x and in a Snari like this, ever, but the way I model a personally my finances that every two years your money should double. Sorry, at five years, every five, every five years, yes, like to, and for two years, man, I'm then the rock business. That's cool, man. That's really, really interesting and you're totally right. You know, I think anyone who's looking into angel investing or even some early stage funds, sixty two, seventy percent of startups fail, right. So yeah, what you are looking for is the kind of the few home runs that even that out and you get your hundred thousand tenzero x multiple on one or two and then it brings it all brings it all home. Cool Man. Well, that is super interesting. I've got a question for you, more of like a personal question, something I think about a lot. So this is very interesting me. I get interested in things very quickly. We've got this funds. Now I've got my crypto guys deep in that world. You know there I live in Bancouver BC, so we have a pretty thriving cannabis sector. So there's I've got a lot of like angel investments in canters. COMIS is there's all these different things. I do have a, you know, a corporation set up to manage these. How do you structure your your time? I imagine you have a few different LLC's and I guess my actual question is, do you think you'll ever have employees just to help you manage more opportunity? Right, like I look at sometimes thinking about like I guess I should like maybe higher people, but it would kind of be crazy. I wouldn't have a job description, they wouldn't be a typical company, but you could then kind of exploit more opportunities. Is what I see. You ever think about that? So I looked from the thea route where you have an online version, assistance for certain things. I'm outstret you know, I'm working getting a website, bills, working, getting some marketing going, all but being outsource, where I'm a huge believer and do the things you're good at really well and like go very, very deep in certain areas versus going very wide. So for me it's like my focuses are our sales and then working with the investors on raising capital and give them good opportunities to invest in. So for me it's really those two core function versus going wide in, you know, a whole variety of areas, and even when looking at multi family deals, that's you know, the primary responsibilities are in the capital invest relations size, with some ass management, you know, mixed in there as well. But it's really more so on getting a great investor experience versus being spread out and having your hands in every area of the deal. But sat original question of the LLC is one of the luxuries investing in deals such as this is that you're a limited partner. Right your liability is capped at what you put into it. So, for example, you know, if you were a check for a hunter grant into a deal, that's all your liable for. The deal of self sits in LLC for the entire asset. But then your liability is cap just on potentially...

...losing the money you put into it, but there's no personal liability beyond that. Got It. That's cool. It's really, really cool. I like it. Well, to the listeners, I hope we gave you some things to think about here. I know I'm going to go do some some homework on this world now and it's definitely never, never, too early to start. You know, you could be a Bedr that just started and listening to this and you can start laying that foundation early and just learning of what these different avenues because, as you said, once you have some success it, it can compound very quickly and if you have these things ready to go, all the better. All right, before I let you go, I always ask this this question because people are distracted, people are busy when they're listening to podcast. If people forget everything in this episode except for three things, e. The things we discussed their honestly, just things that are really important to you that you want to pass onto folks, what would you want those three things to be? So I think one is put in the hours up front. When like looking out whether you're starting your preyer, starting something, do the hours up front. It gets a lot easier if you do those hours up front, but if you've make the big effort, it snowballs in a big way with that's investing where that fails, for that being the one who's been given the opportunities internally. Like put the effort up front. Second it's figure out what people hate doing and get really good at those things. Right. For example, you look at the FDR world, it's not a glorified Rollo. It's but if you can be well in it, that's your meal ticket to stepping going for everyone doing your career. So get really good at things that people hate doing. And I think third is just just overall compound effects, right, like the the the law of just compounding interest. But whether that's getting better at baals or whether that's investing in something, the earlier you start in, the more committed you order doing it. Time helps heal almost everything, especially real estate. Is that it? If you, if you get an early get in, you know, start when you're younger. You have so much ptential down the road, which is have these keep building in the background. That's what you're doing. And allowing yourself to have the flexibility and freedom of not being tied to stay in a job that you may hate. Right, having the ability to go, you know, I want to go, take three months off from a figure out what I want to do. Right. It allows the flexibility and freedom thenomic decisions based on need, but but on want. Excellent, excellent advice, man, and I really like that. Get really good at things people hate doing. That's that is great advice and I'm with you with the do the work up front, and I remember it can feel very, very difficult and daunting at the beginning of your career to like get the bolder moving. Yeah, if you do that work and you're running at it, yeah, exactly, it picks up any quite quite quick quick and it's a lot of things that people just aren't willing to do it right. A lot of people see the the finished product of something and well, you okay, what did you to get here or both the process like, and there's using not a circle answers, just a lot of doing things that kind of stuck at first until you get good at them and then you just get a lot easier. But yeah, once you get moving, your life become easier really quickly and you have a lot more optionality in both what you do and who you do it with. So I think those are really important things that people will to finish line opposed to like looking at how they get off the starting line. A lot better do. What's that quote along the same line? You do the hard things, your life gets easy. You do the easy things, your life gets hard. Yeah, that's a good one. All right, brother. Well, that was awesome. I love when I get to learn stuff on this podcast. Too. So thank you for jumping on, thanks for sharing your your insights with us, and to all the listeners that hung out, I hope you enjoyed that as much as I did and will see you an next episode.

Thank this was another episode of the sales engagement podcast. To help this get in front of more eyes and ears, please leave us a shining five star review. Join US at sales engagementcom for new episodes. Resources in the book on sales engagement to get the most out of your sales engagement strategy. Make sure to check out outreach. That ioh, the leading sales engagement platform. See you on the next episode.

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