The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 2 months ago

Finding Sales Success on LinkedIn: 108 Tips from 36 "LinkedIn Sales Stars"

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Learn the methods that top salespeople are using on LinkedIn to form better relationships, build their personal brand, and grow business.

Join us as we discuss with Scott Ingram, Account Director at Relationship One:

  • How to optimize your LinkedIn profile for the people you want to attract
  • The difference between soliciting and connecting with people on LinkedIn
  • The value of experimentation on LinkedIn

More information about Scott Ingram and today’s topics:

For more engaging sales conversations, subscribe to The Sales Engagement Podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, our website, or anywhere you get podcasts.

Welcome to the sales engagement podcast. This podcast is brought you by outreach, the leading sales engagement platform, and they just launched outreach on outreach, the place to learn how outreach. Well does outreach? Learn how the team follows up with every lead in record time after virtual events and turns them into revenue. You can also see how outreach runs account based plays, manages reps and so much more using their own sales engagement platform. Everything is backed by data pulled from outreach processes and customer base. When you're done, you'll be able to do it as good as they do. Head to outreach Doo on outreach to see what they have going on. Now let's get into today's episode. So what we're talking about today is fighting sales success on Linkedin. A hundred eight tips from thirty six linked in sales stars and Scott for those people who joined us but maybe don't know the legendary Scott and grunt as well as I do. Who Are you? What you come from and you know how do you learn all these sales secrets from linked that? Yeah, so we'll just talk about today. We won't go back into the ancient history. But I am a quota carrying sales guy. Work for a professional services firm called relationship one and and most of my clients are fortune five hundred companies who use the Oracle Marketing Cloud. I'm a former Eliqua guy and the they were my favorite part or when I was selling Eloqua, and now I've worked with them for about the last four years. So I'm responsible personally for a three million dollar services number with them. And then, in my spare time I started all this stuff. That really began about three and a half years ago with the sales success stories podcast, where I only interview active quota carrying individual contributors in the rule is they have to be the number one top performer or a joke. I'm willing to settle for the top one percent. So if somebody happens to be number two on a team of five hundred, that is good enough for me. So that's that's where this started and all of this content, I mean the sales success stories podcast and this linkedin project in particular. I'm a big believer in learning from the people who are doing it the best right now, and so I really after a coffee meeting with Scott Lease, another Scott who was practically my neighbor. He lives within about a mile of me here in Austin. He really challenged the way that I had been approaching linkedin and and I really decided to sort of shift my strategy in my approach and I've really been thinking about Lengkedin and this new approach that I've been taking. And as I was getting ready to do a Webinar, I thought, Hey, you know, at Linkedin's really hot topic. I'm learning a lot about this. How can I serve the community around this topic? And I just went back to what I'm all about, which is, let's find the people who were doing at the very best and figure out what they're doing, because that's what's working right. Let's let's not talk about this, let's see what the real doers are doing. So tell me a little bit up this idea, behind these interviews, behind this ebook. What is kind of the model you use to identify these quote unquote, linked in sales stars? Yeah, so what I wanted to find was something that was publicly available, right, so you wouldn't need any sort of special tool to be able to do it, that you could pull together pretty quickly and evaluate anyone and easily evaluate yourself and kind of compare. And so the model that I looked at to me, what matters the most on Linkedin, I think the the most visible outward sign of success is a high level of engagement. Right. It's one thing and as I was as I was pulling this together, I found people who had tens, even hundreds of thousands of followers on Linkedin and then they would get a post and they couldn't even get a cricket to like their post. And so I really started to look at okay, let's dive into this engagement model. And so what you can do, and you can do this on anybody, you can do it on yourself, if you go to the profile and in the activity section, Click on see all activity and on. There you can narrow it down to just the posts. So Click that post option. And what we did is I looked at their last ten posts because sometimes, you know, people have a big post that goes viral and I wanted to kind of smooth things out. So we decided to look at the last ten and if you just simply add up the number of likes and comments across those ten posts, so twenty numbers that you're adding up and then take that number and divide it by their total number of followers. And the reason we do that is now you get a percentage. Now you get an engagement rate, and it in some ways, if it favors folks who don't have massive, massive followings, because if you've got a massive following, you gotta really have a high level of engagement to sort of make the list. So I wanted it to be really accessible and shine a spotlight not just on the people that had twenty, thirty, forty, fiftyzero followers, but people that had three thousand, four thousand followers but we're still getting a hundred comments on every one of their posts and things like that. So we drew the bar. We said look, he I had got to have at least twenty five hundred followers. So you go got to be in the game at some level, ...

...and then an engagement rate above five percent. And what I've done and the place that we've assembled all of this in a the PDF is free. It's not even gated. You don't even have to put your contact info in there. If you go to top one, DOT FM, forward, slash linked in, sales stars, all one big messy thing, on that page. I've started to create that list and through this process I'm committed to keeping that list more or less up. Today I'll do probably monthly updates. I'm going to keep the at least about the top hundred. Right now there's maybe fifty five people on that list. So when we do the next update, update everybody stats, add some new folks, call at the end of April, early May, we're going to have a hundred folks on there that, again are driving those high levels of engagement. I think that's a good place to go and look and see. Who Do I look at? So it's just follow and understand and learn from what they're doing. So the tips that I collected are amazing and I would I reached out to these folks. Got You were one of them. Appreciate you. You participating in the in the project. I asked them for three things. I said, number one, what's the advice that you have for somebody that's just getting their start on Linkedin? Maybe they've had an acount for a while, because I think a lot of people have had an account for a while but they're not the not really doing much with it. I'm like, what's the most important thing that they need to do. And then the second tip I said, give me a more advanced tip. So if somebody's got all of the basics pretty well nailed, what's the next thing that they should do to really get a lot of value and benefit from the linkedin platform? And then for the third tip, I said, look, I want your secret sauce, like what's the one thing that you're doing that's moving the needle the most? And so that that's basically the format for those tips. It's amazing how this type of project works. I knew maybe a third of the folks before going into it. Of these thirty six contributors, nearly everybody said Yes. And again it just testament to how much people are willing to contribute to be a part of this community and pay it forward and give back. And then the the result is that PDF or we've got a hundred and eight tips. It's it's actually a lie. I think it's a hundred twelve tips. There's I'm the thirty seven person, so there's there's a lot in there. It's really really just a amazing stuff and again we tried to get into at least some glimpses of some of the secret sauce and what is really working the best at the highest levels of performance from this platform. I love it. I love it and a testament to you, of course, and the community that you you've built. I think that's why a lot of people are willing to share their secret sauce with you and you're always given to the community. So I loved how you how you did this right. So you've got this thirty six, which is actually fifty five, and you wittled it down using this engagement metric, and everyone on there I highly respect. I think he did a great job kind of whittling it down. So not all engagement is created equal. Would you is that a fair statements? Gott, totally fair statement. And and why don't you talk about why that's true? Yeah, yeah, so because of the Algorithm, which will go into the Algorithm, and you know there's mixed feelings about the algorithm, but because the algorithm, for whatever reason, written posts do much better, much better than videos, much better than if you're sharing a graphic of any sort of course, of the share links. Then you're not even in the game. So I know if I post written content every single day, that engagement metric would go quite a bit because that's what it favors. I get more likes, more comment what I do find, I still will do a video or two a week, perhaps a graphic thrown in there as well, is a I find rich media is just more pleasant experience, you know, when I follow someone and I get to see what they're like on video, to get to see maybe a photo of them, it's just more enjoyable of a following experience. And then too, I've actually seen when I post a video, yes, I won't get as many likes or comments on it, but I actually might get more connection requests, which is interesting and my hypothesis is that people feel more connected with me that way. Hundred percent. Yeah, so I think videos probably the most extreme example. So to your point, the the algorithm loves just straight text, use lots of words. Get people, you know, reading through and spending a little bit of time on that post and commenting. Videos never perform as as well. But from an experiential standpoint, right, if an image is worth a thousand words, what's a video worth? Right, people are seeing your body language, in the way that you're acting, in the way that you're talking, and they they get your passion and all the other things that you can't possibly get in a text post. And I think it it converts better. To your point, you're getting more followers, you're getting a deeper level of engagement. So linked in and by my by this kind of methodology of looking at engagement, yeah, you're getting short changed a little bit. So it's not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. And and Jake dunlap actually had a great tip about this and he talked about like don't, don't pander to the algorithm. You know, don't, don't solely look at just the game, the in the way that Linkedin's trying to get you to play it. You got to kind of find your own game and you got to find what works. And Jake's a guy who does a ton of video and he does it...

...extraordinarily well and he's got a super engaged following and a following that again for him and their business does convert right. There's there's a meaningful impact in the work that he's doing on linked in, even though he's going beyond just plain text. Yeah, Sortaly, you could almost see those people who get swallowed by the Algorithm, who are chasing the algorithm. So to speak in there. It kind of have an initial big bang and then almost fade away over time because it's not authentic and people can kind of feel it and sense it. What are the basics if somebody hasn't really been actively using Linkedin and where? Where should they start? Yeah, so let's talk about two things. Let's talk about your profile, which is probably the thing, and then let's talk about comments, right, because the the power of Linkedin, I think, is kind of that next level and going to the engagement level, and comments are the easier way to do that. But from a profile perspective, that's the representation of you. So at the very basics, think, think about the elements that are seen everywhere. Anytime you show up on Linkedin, your photo is going to be there. So whatever that headshot images, hopefully you've got something there, because if you've got just a static, the fake image, because hey, you don't have a photo here, fix that. Your title or description or whatever you put in that area is also really key and then you know that. I think the goal of that is to bring people to you and get them to click to your profile and then learn more about you. So I think if you're prioritizing it. Take care of that headshot right. Invest the money, get a good, professionally done headshot. Do the best you can. Write. Think about how do you want to represent yourself. You can go beyond just talking about this. As you know, name rank in s real number right. You don't have to talk about just your title. A lot of people, I don't always agree with it, but a lot of people talk about in that in that title description, using a benefit statement, talking specifically about here's who I serve and how I serve them, and using that as a way to bring in your ideal client. I think that's a totally valid strategy. And then, once you've got that Neild, look at the rest of your profile and particularly for us in sales, I think the most important thing is it needs to be for your client and about them and how you serve them. It shouldn't be hey, I'm an uber quota crusher and I'm the greatest part I've gone to every president's club known to man. Your clients don't care about that. That's not who they want to buy from, right. So represent yourself the way you want to be seen and perceived by those that you're trying to attract and then switching over to the to the comments again. I think it's so much it's easy to take the pressure off of that blank what's happening? You know, what are you doing, or whatever the prompt is for a brand new, fresh post and just finding stuff that you agree with or that you want to engage with, that challenges you. That comes from these other sales stars right. There's just so much great stuff that they're putting out there. Get thoughtful and engage in the comments and it's such a great way to practice for getting good at posting later on and you'll find you can do a lot of damage in the comments and really be known. I mean, if you're consistent about that, think about whose radar you might want to be on. Do you have an ideal client that's that's active on linkedin consistently comment and thoughtful ways on their posts? They are gonna notice. They're going to be looking at your profile going like this is this guy, this is interesting. Totally. I agree. The profile being unbelievefully, you know, important and really take some time. Like your first line and you're about should literally say everything about you, pretty much right. Everything I need to know, because there's a seamore button. Not everyone's going to click that. That first line is so unbelievably important, just like your first line of any post that you decide to do later. At first line in your about section so important, you know, for me it's it's actually a line from Charlie Chaplin dictator speech, and it just says we all want to help one another. Human beings are like that, and that's really like what I try and stand for. That's like my ethos. So find whatever your ethosis steel a quote, ready yourself, do whatever and make sure it's front and center, you know, of course having pictures or table stakes. And then I'll quickly share my kind of four step framework, which I shared in the the PDF, because it's very much I get started framework and we will get more advanced and I used to teach people who came to be like the more advanced stuff and then I develop this kind of four step process to get people going. So if you're just brand new, here's my kind of four step process. So number one, you're going to be a listener. So what a listener does is just understand what is going on on, Linkedin what people are responding to and then maybe making some thoughtful comments every now and again. Right you're just showing up. People are going to start being like, Hey, who's this is the Scott Ingram guy. He always says something interesting in my comment. So you're going to do that...

...for a few weeks. Then you're going to start going out there and essentially aggregating. So there's listener stage than an aggregator stage. We're going to go out and find content for your ICP, whoever you're trying to build a community for, and you're going to go out and aggregate all this information and you're going to just share it. Don't worry about the algorithm. That's for later. Just get that muscle memory going. And you need to consume content so that you can create content later. You need to have a lot of input in order to have output. Then you're going to go Jamie's got it. Then you synthesize. Next, then you're going to synthesize that information into bullet points. Your are three things that I learn. Do that for a few weeks and then, and only then, start creating actual content, and we'll go into kind of how to do that. But Listener, aggregator, synthesizer and then creator is a good, easy, kind of way to get your toes wet. Yeah, and what I love about that model, scut is, is they build upon each other and once you move from one stage to the other doesn't mean you stop doing the other one. Right, you ought. You're always listening, you're always synthesizing as you as you move through, sort of that hierarchy of greatness. Totally, totally, any I'm trying to think of any other super basics. So we all know. You know, links hurt your engagement. Don't put links in your actual post. Worry about that later, but that is a pretty big basic that you could get frustrated. If you're wondering why I mentioned this, but are to reiterate first line is so important. Oftentimes, Scott, I don't know what you I'll write a post and then I'll be like, oh, that's what I was trying to get at, and then I'll actually extract, like the the main point I'm trying to get across and actually put it at the beginning so it kind of catches people's attention. So I think it's kind of with with both of those things, right, if we think about the profile and we think about those posts, you're trying to lead people to the next step. Right. So I want my picture in my headline to be engaging enough to get you to click on my profile and I want that first line or two in my about section to be interesting enough that you're going to want to go deeper and learn more about me and then maybe you go read an article or you start looking at posts. Same thing with your when you're doing the posts. Right, how do I get somebody to click that seemore button and read the rest of the post and then how do I get them to click that like button or how do I get them to comment? Am I asking a question? Am I? Am I really asking for a training to create that engagement in that conversation? Totally. And just to clarifying. Yeah, so you would put the link in either the comments or you can actually go back. I've found now if you wait like forty five minutes and go put the link in the Post. You can actually do that now and it won't won't hurt you, which is kind of interesting. Okay, so let's dive more into so let's say we have our our profile set up, comments set up. What are some of these tips that some of these experts did about how can I start actively posting? Where do I going to start here? Yeah, so you know where. I love the starting point. Sarah Brazier, who was recently on my sales success rase podcast. She's the number one SDR at Gong, has a incredibly engaged group of folks that are that are following her and what she posts, and she just said, you know, it's like Nike, you know, you just do it, like, don't worry about it. And the thing is, when you're getting started you're not going to have a huge level of engagement in thousands of people that are going to be seeing this stuff. So you're going to learn by doing and just sort of practicing and know that don't worry, like not many people are going to see that early stuff. You have to be and I think it's important to sort of establish some expectations here, and some of the tips that are really good job of that. Of like expect that this is going to take six months before you really start to see something really, really meaningful. But the good news is the level of activity that you need to to do linkedin well, and this came up in a whole variety of different ways also in the tips, is three to five times a week is really good, like daily is is a lot and very few people. I think the recommendation is actually going beyond daily. People have mixed opinions about whether or not there's even value in that. So I think it's just a matter of doing it right, getting started, choosing to be consistent and committing to it and then deciding just what is that consistent see for you right? For me, I've experimented a couple of times and tried to get to daily. I've already got a daily podcast, like I don't know what more freaking thing that I need to do. So for me, a few times a week is great, right, and I'm seeing incredible results. It really doesn't take a lot, which is the beauty of all of this, and you know really from there, I think, once you start to develop that muscle memory, once you get into the practice, once you know, hey, I want to be posting, it starts to tune your radar. It kind of your sensensation, synthesization. I can't even say what the plural of that work is. Got Yeah, as your synthesizing, you're starting to stort of pay attention to what am I experiencing and he here's the thing. I think this is about you and I saw one...

...of the questions is like, are you posting about your journey? Are you posting about your clients? Like, who is this for? I think that's one of the things you have to kind of figure out. You have to think about what do I want to be known for? Who Do I want to be attracting and engaging? So, again, if you have a territory and you're focused on a particular industry or you're focused on a particular geography, I think as much as you can, Scott and I are kind of different and that it makes sense for us to be known about sales because of the things that we're doing. But I think for the average sales professional it makes sense, or the above average sales professional need that in a negative way. I think it makes more sense to focus on your clients, your prospects, your ideal kind of target market, and starting to create content for them, create content with them, and so sharing stories about here's an experience that this client had, right they had this challenge and here's how they work through it, and maybe that's inspirational in a way. That is and Scott, we should probably talk about this. You have to Josh to Shay and the tip set it best. He's like, you have to master the art of selling without selling on this platform. This is not a place to come pitch and to be dropping all the here's how great I am, here's our product, features and benefits. It is not that at all. You know it works best is it's about telling stories. That's what works. It's about being authentic, it's about being vulnerable. Rachel May, who works with Keenan, has a great tip where she talks about if you want to build an audience, then be authentic. If you want to build, Oh what did she say? A movement? She's got it, just a great word. You'll have to look it up in the PDF. But if you really want to go to the next level, be vulnerable. Right, share the things that everybody's thinking but nobody's saying right, like, the more you put yourself out there and your real and stell and and share just human stories and example and the real stuff, that is what connects with people, that's what people want to hear, that's what humanizes you and really builds this this type of following, a community. Totally. Yeah, and I believe it was authenticity builds a following, vulnerability builds an empire. There he goes. Right. So Ma per fact was that's the good one. I like that a lot and it's so true. I think that's essentially just good writing. Right, the best writers in the world, you think it's the best novels, even if it's like a fiction novel. You relate to this fiction, this story of Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings, because there's so much truth in the story. Right. So definitely, the more you can get to closer to your, you know, authentic self, the better it's going to come across. And okay, so I want to readierate a few things. So if I were to make a written posts with an article attack you would actually hurt your engagement. Yes, it would. So do your written posts and then say if you want to see the full blog article, put it in the comments, and then just put it in the first comment. It will hurt you. And the reason is very simple. A lot of people, I like why? Linkedin, if you think about it, wants you to stay on Linkedin. So if you're redirecting people off of linkedin onto another website, it's not in their best interest. So they're going to show less people that. So that's why you put it in the comments. I'm sure the attach on sooner later, but that's it's the world we live in. Still, let's and why don't we? Why don't we switch gears a little bit? I want to talk of it. So we've been talking a lot about profiles and posting and comments and all of this stuff. Let's talk about if it's a little bit more relevant from a sales standpoint, like if you're using this this platform because you're trying to set meetings, you're trying to generate opportunities and you're connecting and engaging with people. I've seen a couple of messages about that here. Questions about that. What's the conversion rate? What are the statistics around messages to meetings kind of on the linkedin platform? Here's what I'll say about that. If the messages the people are sending are anything like this garbage that I receive where you can see. So if you start pitching in the connection request, you're probably not getting a lot of people accepting your connection request, because every time that happens, like I know what comes next, like I accept this thing and I get a pitch like don't. The last thing in the world that you want to do is connect and pitch right. And it's interesting. So Josh Roth wrote an article for the ebook which is which is an even more expanded version of the PDF that we're going to be releasing next Wednesday. He talked about the difference between soliciting and selling and he uses this great like time square analogy. Right, like if you're just standing on the corner and you're in like a freaking make mini mouse costume and you're just trying to get people to take pictures with you and you're asking every single person with the same undifferentiated message, that's soliciting. Hopefully you're above that, right. Hopefully we're here to learn how to sell effectively. And you know who did this best? And it's not it's not even in any of this content. I shared it in one of the daily sales tips because the the full interview is two hours, but when I talked with Sarah Brazure, I took a...

...snippet from that conversation and she talked about the perfect way to prospect on Linkedin and all it is. It's about starting conversations, it's about starting conversations that are centric to the person that you're talking to. It's about doing that little bit of research, talking about something that they're doing, that they're interested and hopefully it's it should be more connected to business. Right. I think this whole like, Oh, you like the sports time, I like that sports team kind of stuff, that other work. I'm want. Come on and try a little harder, right, and and really find things to connect on. So if you can begin a conversation, ask some questions. Naturally do that. And Man, you've got to do patients. She talks about you know, on average it's probably a week before she's gonna make sort of a soft pitch and ask for a meeting. Right. This isn't as Josh Rotha again, was was doing his research on this, on this soliciting. He was just looking at his own messages and he's like, basically, nobody gets past two messages without pitching. You can do better than two messages. So engage thoughtfully, do that little bit of research. I'm a big believer, just across the board, in quality. Trump's quantity. Right, it's this is a quality game. So pick your shots, don't spray and pray. Right, be specific about these are the ideal people I want to reach out to. Don't make it a hundred today, make it twenty. Make it a manageable number of people where you're going to be able to spend it it. Don't spend a ton of time, spend three minutes, spend five minutes reading a couple of their articles, reading a couple of their posts. Talk about those things, talk about the insights that they shared, dig deeper into those, start a conversation about that to learn more about them and learn about your market and then, if it makes sense and you're sort of progressing in that way, then I think you can absolutely say, Hey, I think there's some things we're working on. Based on what you've talked about, there's good value and reason for us to spend a little bit of time on the phone together. Would you be open to that? People were very rarely. Once you've engaged in that type of thoughtful, meaningful dialog are going to say no to that, and I'd really encourage you go go listen to that. Tip daily sales dot tips is where all of those live, and it wasn't very long ago. Is maybe a week or two ago. Yeah, we got some great stuff here in the chat and I want to highlight something of why that works for her, Sarah as well, because I get people connecting with me all the time and actually saying clearly cowful messages, sometimes being like Hey, I think we could help you an Xyz, you know, just trying to start a conversation, see if there's a bit. I'll almost never respond. But Sarah connects first and then, I would imagine, I'm not sure, but she probably wakes a little while and because she's creating content every day, this person starts understanding Sarah. She they know what she's about, they understand her and then a week or two later, month later, whenever it is, they now feel like they know Sarah. I know for me I have eighteen thousand one side of relationship to all of you know, I'll feel like they know me and then you know I don't know them, and sometimes people will like forget that. But it's a good thing. And so it's not just send Scott Ingram a connection request, he accepts and then try and start a conversation. Hey, how's it going, Scott? I think this is relevant. I think you have to warm them up to you, your personality, what you stand for and that's what content is about, and it's about getting them to kind of lean into you and actually creating an inbound lead engine. Like there's also a world where those people see you so much that they reach out and I hey, man, like, what are you doing these days like this? It's interesting that you're up this. I Bet Sarah gets, you know, in bounds from time to time as well. So that's part of the reason you connect content, is to kind of keep that relationship going when you're not actually having a conversation. Beats got the other person who does that extraordinarily well and perfectly exhibits what you just talked about as amy quick, so gamy I describe it took me again, almost a twohour conversation to sort of get to the heart of what was going on, because I found out so that she was early in this project, that I had reached out to her and I was like, you are doing some epically amazing stuff. I want to talk about what you're doing, and I learned in that conversation, Hey, look at conversation, that in January she sourced ten million dollars in net new pipeline. All three linked it, and so I had to have her on sale success stories right, that that's a successive if I've ever heard one, and we really started to dig into that and I really believe what it is. She is superhuman. She is the most just authentic, like there's just a me. There's not business amy, there's not vacation amy, there's just any and you get to know her. She is so real and so unique in the way that she posts. I've never seen anybody used as many emojis as effectively as she does. It is redculous. I think she did one the other day that had over a hundred emojies. It was absolutely insane. I don't know how she does it, but it's she built that just human front and was doing exactly what you're talking about, Scott, right. She'd had these connection and it was just over time that...

...these executives were seeing who she was and then, you know, the time was right. She was top of mine. She was there. They're like, man, you seem awesome. Well, you know, let's let's talk about this, because I think you might be able to help. You know, it's not rocket science, but again it's that persistence and consistency and just being real and not being over the top. And and and if you can't wait five minutes to pitch, you know, Time squares looking for more mini mouses relieve man. Totally all right. So there's a lot of things popping out about audio messages. Yeah, I use audio messages from time to time. I've heard a lot of people have a lot of success with them and Scott, would love to hear some of your your findings with audio messages. The one thing I will say it's people always look for a silver bullet. People always I like, you know, what's the best email template? What's did this cold call opener do? Audio messages were all theously. Remember, all these things are mediums, right. It's still about the message in that medium. So if you're just sending a bunch of generic audio messages, it's not going to be the silver bullet. But if done effectively, they are a novel thing right now. So there's a first movers advantage. They're just like when it video first came out, if you send a video over email, people were like Whoa, and now it's, you know, kind of normal. So there is a first movers advantage. But, Scott, I know some people talk about audio messages in the book. When to talk a little bit about them, for sure, so and I lump them together. I think both do messages and video messages, and in this case we're talking about the direct messaging capability. So this has nothing to do with audio or video posts. This is Scott Barker and I are connected and is only works in both instances. This only works on the mobile APP. You can't do this on your laptop, on the desktop version of Linkedin. So in the mobile APP you can record an audio. The audio limitation is one minute, so that's that's all you get. You got to fit your message in sixty seconds or less. I don't think there's a video limitation if you record the video in there. But to Scott's point, it still to this day is quite novel. Or there's a couple of tips in the PDF that talk about this, where again people are surprised. It's something different that they haven't seen before. So you're able to take take advantage of sort of the novel thing. Again, I think this goes back to going beyond text posts and the video discussion we had earlier. It's humanizing. I get to hear your voice. I got a great one the other day. Brand new connection just wanted to introduce himself. He was in the Caribbean. I could hear birds in the background. It sounded freaking amazing, right, I could tell he was outside. It was so cool. Right, it was, because, again, it was it was a humanizing thing. Like I can literally picture James and he's recording this message for me. And then what's funny is I find this a few times. Oftentimes I'm in a place where I'm not going to record an audio message back. I'll just type back, and so it ends up this like audio text, audio text, audio text, back and forth. But I think it works. It's actually how I originally connected with Tab Cavinaugh, tab the recruiter who's in the in the PDF, and she just Jesus says extraordinarily well, and it just it makes you human. It's a little bit different, it's a little bit extra work because you got to do the work, you got to be in a quieter place, or maybe you go outside and have some birds chirping and just share that that more humanizing message. And here's I want to go back to a really big theme, Scott, that you started to talk about earlier. Right, when we talk about this is a thing. Here's the exact tactic you need to use. If there's anything that you take away from all of this, what I want you to understand is there are a gajillion ways to use this platform. You need to just play with it, experiment with it and find the way that is yours, that you know. There's there's lots of tips where folks are talking about you just have to figure out how to be you. You have to find your voice, and it's not just those things. I think you also have to find your style. I should probably be doing a lot more audio messages, given how much audio stuff I do in the world. Video not really my favorite thing. Okay, how can you leverage that? How should I be leveraging that? You know, and just really experimenting, figuring out what's working, what's resonating. And I think the other thing that's really important here, and I hope people will sort of see the Meta example of what I did this whole pdf, the Ebook, these webinars that have been record breaking Webinarre that we did the first one on the sales like the those experts channel. They've done over five hundred webinars over the years. This is the biggest webinar they'd ever seen literally smashed a record and it's because it's bringing people together. And again, I only knew a third of the folks before I started this project and I don't think it actually had very much to do with WHO. I am right, I think it had so much more to do with this is about making it about them and making it about the great work that they're doing and recognizing that. So yeah, I think you can look...

...at this example and you don't have to do it this big, but you don't have to reach out to thirty six people. But what if you started creating this little micro community with even three or four people who are your ideal customers and almost turn them into mentors? And in fact, Logan Lyles kind of talks about in this in this tip. He he talks about pods, which is a popular topic, but what I love about his spin on it is he talks about creating pods with and for your customers. What if you were to help them develop their presence and their voice and their reach on Linkedin? Do you think those relationships might turn around and they might be in a position to want to buy from you, to refer you, to help you with reference conversations all of those things you like do this with and for your community. And James Carberry, another contributor to the to the PDF, wrote a book. I mean it is literally my playbook it. Thank you, James, for writing that. So his book is called content based networking and it's exactly this idea. Right. So, whether it's a tip thing or it's a pdf or it's it's this, you know, invite people to have a conversation and we're just going to stream it on a Webinar. Maybe a thousand people show up, maybe not, write at the end of the day it doesn't matter. What matters more is Scott and I were already friends. We're better friends because we get to interact this way right and go a little bit deeper and share some time and hopefully make some contributions and provides value to you. Startaly and just to touch on something, because I don't know the level of everyone joining us. So a pod is something that exists on Linkedin. The reason for them existing if something we didn't touch on, but the algorithm in the first forty minutes, the very, very important time for how much reach your post will get. If you write a post, you put it on Linkedin, the first forty minutes after you publish. It is extremely important. They'll basically bucket you into three different camps. You know, only your first degree connections will see it, your secondary connections or your third degree connections, and that's when you kind of go viral. And that's based on how many likes, comments, shares and interaction you get in that first forty minute. So people have game of FID that with Linkedin pods. So they will create a pod with ten other creators or friends or CO workers or colleagues and post their article or their post in there and they all interact with it in the first forty minutes. So it helps them get into that other bucket of engagement it. Scott, what are your thoughts on pods? I do love the way you set it up doing it for your customers, because then it's a it's a give. What are your thoughts? I've so many mixed feelings about this in general. I don't like it. I think that these types of things are at some point Linkedin, will make their algorithm smarter than it is today and they're going to pick up on garbage like this and and it's just it doesn't really work. Here's what I will say, if you are going to do it in some of the most powerful tips, I think, are almost also the most dangerous. You know, there's a couple of tips in here about the essentially stoking controversy right, like really putting it out there and man, and I'm telling you, super powerful. It can drive tons of engagement. It could drive tons of engagement and I taken ardy. It's great. Do not want that. That's hand has great at walking the line of like, yeah, it's dicey stuff, but it's also true. So if you speak truth, like we talked about in the beginning, it will resonate. But I think it's honestly, it's terrible advice. Of you're a beginner. Yeah, totally, totally, I won't even do it generally. Yeah, it's just it's just too over the edge. So again, some of the most powerful tips are almost also the most dangerous. I think the only real way of pot is powerful in this this kind of like ruins the whole thing for everybody else. But I feel like you have to be the one to create it and you have to be the one to curate it and really be picky and specific about who you want in that and why? Because it's funny if somebody reached out to me yesterday and ask and said, hey, we're spending up this pod, we're doing this stuff, and I'm like, yeah, I've makes feelings. To tell you what, I'll give it a try. I'm already it hasn't been twenty four hours. I'm like, I'm out. This is this is not my thing, because you have to believe in the content that everybody else is posting. Do you want to be known for that? Do you want to be associated with that? And not that there was anything wrong with what it was, but it's just not an alignment with my brand and the core things that I'm really focused on and the value that I'm trying to deliver. So I think it really goes back to if you're going to use a POD, be super thoughtful about it and be in some ways kind of really selfish about it. Think of it as like an it's almost like building your own networking group or building your own dinner party. Who Do you want in that and what do you want the interactions between the other people to be? Because that's where I think the the real magic and the power is, and that's why I logans tip from particular was so good is this could be really good if you're connecting your other customers right and and it's really helping you understand their thought process in the way that they think, and there's a lot of value and them know each knowing each other...

...if they didn't already. Yeah, totally all right. Well, so we have a ton of questions. I think we're just going to start rapid firing. Will try and be assist let's go fast. There's a quick one, Jeff So, I can you give us an example of a solid first audio message? I'll give that one a shot. I would keep it simple, don't overthink it, just be like, you know, hey, jeff so, happy to be connected with you. I saw this post that you did, you know, last week regarding x. You know, what really stuck out to me is the line where you said this can't a way to continue learning from each other. Have a great one. Hope you stand safe and staying in this crazy world we live. It simple, no ass just give make that connection, start creating content. Warm Jeff Up and then maybe you can start another conversation and a few weeks. But some of these there's reference one thing in their profile, like do the thirty seconds of research right. That's going to put you in the top five or ten percent of the people that are reaching out and then ask a question right. We're really try and to start a conversation with with that message, so to here's another one. How do you guys balance your time engaging? How do you present yourself from going into linkedin black holes? That's a great one. Scott love this question and I tried to dig into it early, early on as I was working through this process. If you look at my own posts and go back a ways, I think I actually shared a screen shot of my own whatever. The the time tracking thing is on your iphone, right, that shows when your activities and how much time you're spending. That's a really good way. The trick is you do have to find the balance, like Scott said, with the algorithm, that first hour is kind of the Golden Hour. So don't post and ghost. What you want to do is post at a time where you're going to have a little bit of bandwidth after that to maybe ask a couple of people strategically where this message is going to resonate, to connect with with that idea and just be there to comment, because think about my own model. If you get fifty comments on a post and you reply to every one of those comments, that's you know, I have a hundred comments on the post. So you get to kind of gamify the system in that way. For me, I'm a productivity nerd and I will I prioritize my linked and activity really early and then late and I in some cases I will turn it off during the day because I just don't need it pulling at me because I'm trying to get real, actually work done. So that first hour and then maybe you revisit it at lunch and you revisit it again in the evening just to continue to stay engaged, and engagement is key, right. If somebody's taking the time to comment, send them a no back, comment back, just send them a private message to thank them. Start those conversations. That's where the magic is. Totally. Yeah, I'll just quickly pile on that. Yeah, so I get mine done super early in the morning before my day starts, from six to seven, I have like a morning routine. As part of that morning routine I'm thinking of what I'm going to post. I posted at a try and hang out for the next like twenty minutes and engage. And then I've got I don't know if you can see this here. So on the last thing, it's time time oisters and it's on the very last page. If my iphone. It's funny to call it a time wister when we're on a linkedin thing. But, you know, similar to Scott, I actually have the same now have a three million dollar number. I have to hit that. It's the most important thing. All of this other stuff. It's Great, nice to have, it's not us to have right, like hit your number. Smash your number. That is number one that. I have to say that. You know, I need time. We do this. If you're if you're not hitting your number and you're spending time. Personal branding wrong. I'm not sure. Rang. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Here's the bigger piece on that. Like, if you need a deal, you need a meeting this week. Don't start working on Linkedin. Like this is a very long game. You've got to be super patient in this. This is not the answer. Totally. Yeah, it'll be. Get the phone now, in six months you'll read the benefit, pick up the phone, Bang it out. Yeah, right. And then the other thing I do actually so that I can engage sometimes throughout the day. If I have a meeting and I'm in eight to ten meetings a day, but I'm a meeting that goes like early, then I'll spend some of that time on Linkedin. It's great because it serves a dual purpose. One. I tried to be really sucync with my meetings and don't waste any time. To reward. There you go and to it's my it's kind of my reward. All right, let's do this is a good one that we briefly touched on, but I think it's so important. I get this question a lot. I'm sure you do too, bobby. Thanks the question. Is it better to speak to your role and what you're learning or try to speak to thought leadership for your target persona? I think there's a balance. A hundred percent agree. Yeah, I think Nikki Ivy has a great tip about you don't need a title to be posting about this right. There's there's value in each of us kind of sharing our journey. And so again, look at amy quick and what she's doing. All these folks. It's you want to kind of talk about your experience and what's real for you, but that's really got to be balanced. Right. If who you're selling to has nothing to do with sales and all you're doing is talking about sales, that doesn't make sense, right. You you really need to find ways to post stuff that is relevant to your ideal buyer. And to Scott's point, you just you got to kind of find the right balance, experiment, find your way, find your voice. Totally. Yeah, I do a mixture of like my overall business views, my overall I use very tactical sales advice,...

...throw in a little bit of, you know, things that we're doing in the industry, a few asks. You're in there to join this, hang out this. It's yeah, you got to experiment on the last you'll find out what works for you. But if I was selling into non sales, I would still share some of my sales journey because that's what I'm going through every day. But more often I would I would spend trying to create thoughtful content that by personas would would care about. It's about being consistent. If you set a goal, continue thought to ask you. Yeah, and the three to five times a week in the daily suggestions. That is regarding posts. Right, comments, go crazy, right, do as much you're as little as you want there. You might want to set different goals. There a game that I like to play for myself and and any Volis has a great, great tip about just engaging thoughtfully. Like, if you're going to comment, it's not valuable to say a great post. I agree, right, like really dig in talk about the why. A game I play with myself. I try to win the comments. I want to have the most thoughtful, insightful comment. That my comment, even though this doesn't play into the algorithm anywhere, it just it's psychically thrilling to me. I want to get the most likes in the most engagement on my comment, even if it has nothing to do's not even one of my posts. I love that and that forces you to be extra thoughtful. I get a Ley. Sometimes I get in bad habits, but just love it. Awesome, because I just want to show the course I'm supporting them. Ruse. I'd right like it, but I'm like, I'm so busy, but that's a good way to do it. When the comments I think that's that's awesome. One of the things which seems extremely obvious but I'm going to say it anyway, because sometimes I even forget today every time I have a meeting on my calendar, those meetings that I'm on every single days. As you're waiting for them to show up in the zoom or you're not admitted to the zoom room yet, going quickly connect. You know a sales people always talk about getting ghosted. I haven't been ghosted in the last year and a half since I've had reputation on Linkedin, because they won't get back to me for two weeks and then they'll scroll their feed and they'll see a post and then Ah, okay, and I know that's why they get back to me. I know it is. Should be part of your meeting preper you should be doing your research, you should be looking your profile and if they're an advanced linkedin user, they're going to see, hey, Scott, looked at my profile. Okay, this guy's doing he's doing his job, he's doing the work. You know. I'm not going to have to explain who I am and what I do and you could just read my freakuient profile. How frequently should you switch your style and approach before making changes? How do you know when it is time to change? I think you're going to have to experiment with your experiment there. You're definitely thinking about it right to recognize that, hey, you're going to need enough data points past before making a decision. Jake dunlap talked about this is as well in terms of think of every post as just a data point. Some things works, sometimes things don't work. Don't get hung up on that. Just think of it is this is a data point. What can I learn from this and just keep moving forward? Yeah, totally. Do you think it's important to interact on their activity before the DM's go out? I would strongly recommend interacting with their content before you DM DM is like last last resort. You know, honestly, your goal should be to get them to lean into you. My goal, honestly, is great such interesting, compelling content show up so thoughtfully in my network and make all these comments on all these people that they they want to reach out and it happens and it will blow your mind the first time it happens, but then it will happen more more frequently, I d and especially last resort, brilliant. Okay, what percentage of people, potential clients who have linkedin accounts actually read the postings regularly? The high level data seems to be that it's only one percent of everybody that's on Linkedin it that is actively posting. Yeah, and if you look at you know how many people post reviews versus right reviews? It's a significant multiple. So if it's one percent that are posting, I'd say it's probably twenty percent that are kind of actively regularly reading. I am often all the time surprised by somebody that I'm just randomly interacting with it I haven't seen in a while that I don't even think about is as being connected to on Linkedin. It starts spewing my post back to me, and this is talking about things I've written about my holy I had no idea. Right. So it's it's more than you think, but it's not everybody really. Yeah, it is not everyone. And this is all again, like we're here. We don't work for Linkedin like this is. This is stuff that has worked for for us. Like maybe you are in a maybe you're selling to what's a construction maybe, yeah, construction managers, or you're selling to NASA scientists. You don't have time to be on Linkedin. So a lot of what we're talking about is lillnkedin specific. But if you look at the community Scott has built, the sales success community. You look at things like salesacker. That's another community. So the the pro tip, the extra advanced linked in tip, is taking that community off of Linkedin. Yeah, and creating a community, because there is a community for those construction workers that you that you're...

...selling into, or those NASA scientists that you're selling into. Every single person wants to level up and wants to connect everyone, you know, and they are doing that somewhere. So find that somewhere, show up thoughtfully every day and build connections, authentic relationships. That's really what this this is all about. Brilliant. You need a better microphone that you can actually drop, Scott, right now, you have to throw your headset on the ground. Yeah, so that's about finding those, those connections, and I did get this once that someone was like, Hey, I look everywhere and my very niche buyer does not have a community. Make out create it may get yeah, huge opportunity. All right, Scott. Any final words of wisdom? And it was so hard to distill such amazing advice down to just an hour. Anything you want to leave the community to it. Yeah, it's impossible to distill all of this and that's why we've just put it in a free PDF. So again, top one, DOT FM, forwards, linked in sales stars. It's all there for you read. Share what's working for you if you use the Hashtag linkedin sales stars, you know, to share your takeaway, share what's working. Let's continue to learn from each other as a community. It's about learning from the best and learning from what's working. It's got this was fun, you know, it's it's great to be able to engage with with our audience in this way and answer these questions and hopefully help people do more with with Linkedin. Thanks for spending the time with us today. I count myself lucky to know I guy like you, man that's given so much. So thank you. Connect with US book on Linkedin. Join US next time. Stay safe, stay staying see. Yeah, this was another episode of the sales engagement podcast. To help this get in front of more eyes and ears, please leave us a shining five star review. Join US at sales engagementcom for new episodes. Resources in the book on sales engagement to get the most out of your sales engagement strategy. Make sure to check out outreach that ioh the leading sales engagement platform. See you on the next episode.

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