The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 1 year ago

Enabling Internal Champions To Drive Your Business


Would you buy from a company you don’t trust on a personal level? We wouldn’t either.

Every member of your organization that interacts with the customer has the chance to make or break a sale. Recognizing this power can help enable your sales team by removing any pain points along the customer journey.

On this episode of The Sales Engagement podcast, we talk with Vince Maltese, Head of Sales Enablement at Accelya. He joins the show to talk all about:

- Enablement as the ethos of the company

- Company mistakes around enablement & advice on how to improve

- Understanding the Miller Heiman methodology

- The customer journey and post-pandemic changes

- Building out a company’s enablement division

For more engaging sales conversations, subscribe to The Sales Engagement Podcast on Apple Podcasts, on Spotify, or on our website.

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Welcome to the sales engagement podcast. This podcast is brought to you by outreach, the leading sales engagement platform, and they just launched outreach on outreach, the place to learn how outreach well does outreach? Learn how the team follows up with every lead in record time after virtual events and turns them into revenue. You can also see how outreach runs account based plays, manages reps and so much more using their own sales engagement platform. Everything is backed by data pulled from outreach processes and customer base. When you're done, you'll be able to do it as good as they do. Head to outreach dooh on outreach to see what they have going on. Now let's get into today's episode. Good morning everyone, welcome to the sales engagement podcast. You have your host, Caitlin Kelly here, who is a senior St our leader for outreach in the MEA region, and today we are going to be talking all things enablement. Our guest today is a Vince multies, had a sales enablement over at excel. Youa Vince can you'll introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about your career path and how you got it there. Hi Everyone, yeah, name's been smallti spent background. Course, a long while ago I came over the UK. I'm painting. Originally came over the UK about thirty six years ago to work with the company called nortowner. I was an engineer at the time. Movement way through engineering, operations management, went into sales, probably mid early S, mid S, and then around two thousand and one I became independent and really been working with customers on how to do, how to help with sales, sales methodology, sales process, coaching, all the sides to do, always with sales, and I worked through various companies can dependently and actually went back to a company the end of December, which is a Cela, to do what I did before, but do it for them full time. So that's my background. It's origine engineering. Like I said, I came here for a year and I'm still here. So it's all about the weather really, that does it tore me. Yeah, bastic, you know, that is like that is so true. Everyone always asked me when I so moving from Seattle over to London. They're like, oh, what's it for the rain? I'm like yes, once stay consistent here. Amazing. So you know, as we kind of dive into this and talk about sales enablement. This is something that has been around for a while now and I'd say it's more more now than ever that is becoming a parent that companies you to invest in enabling their reps and their teams to make sure that they are successful at the end of the day. And you had quite a few different positions and one thing that you set out to me that really resonated was, you know, enablement is not a job, it's actually in an ethos of a company and our look. Can you tell us a little bit more of what you really mean by that? What I mean by well, it's...

...everybody WHO's sponsibility. ENABLEMENT and enabling the sales forces everybody's responsibility. It's all about what people have to do to ensure that the sales force can do what they do very well and successfully. And when I look at it, I look at every touch point with the customer. You know, operations, customer service, financing, these are all groups that touch the customer and each one of them can make or break a sale because they can damage credibility, and so it's their job to help build the credibility of the company, which in turn helps the salesperson succeed, because people will not buy from someone they don't trust. They will not buy from a company that will trust. So it's important to have some succeed. So every touch points absolutely critical and it helps our credibility throughout, and I mean all the way up and down. So you know, we think, well, what is hr got to do with the customer, while the HR group works along the lines of, you know, compensating the salespeople, keeping them happy. If you haven't got a happy salesperson, you haven't got someone who can sell. So when I say it's everybody's responsibility, it really is the bloodline of the company. So you know, it's not just one person says you're in charge of enablement, off you go. It's really about the whole group. Okay, that makes that makes of our sense there and, however, needs to kind of support each other in that process. You're in your tenure, and especially my consultancy, is what is a mistake that a lot of come these make when they do look at enablement. Is there a way where, like there a right way and a wrong way to go about this, or having you kind of guide your team most important part of that from my point of view is that your support it from the very top. The very top takes along what you're bringing forward. Okay, so it's not just saying I'm going to put this in place and every says that's fine and then walks away. A salesperson, bless them, great, great role, and I've did it for years myself, will take the shortest cut possible to achieve success. That's the job, okay. But when stops put in places, put in place for a purpose, you need support from the very top to make sure it gets implemented, because they know people use their management. It's examples of what's the right thing and what's the wrong thing to do. So you can ask people to do something if you don't support it yourself, and so you know, right from the CEO down, you're measured as a yard stick for their success and therefore it's important that you support what goes forward. So when someone says what's the biggest failure I see in enablement is when the very top actually is just doing it to have someone there, but not actually supporting it and being behind it. That's where I've seen failure before and I've seen a lot of companies in the days of consultancy where they spent a lot of money with me, which is fine. I get no problem with that. But you know, six months later, a year later, whatever we put in place is gone because it was never really supported from the top. So that that's the biggest weakness. I would say. I've an ablement. That's really interesting and so almost as if you need to get build the internal champions to carry these processes all the way...

...through after the consulting consultancy agencies leave or Execu or if people were to move and evolved throughout time, how is that legacy going to continue to deliver? Yeah, it's like tools. Is the same with tools. You know, every tool we buy and we put in place, if no one uses it, it fairly quickly becomes stale and someone will eventually see it as a cost and cut it rather than saying this is now really important to our success. So, and you know, the person who sells that tool or the consultant that's in there can do a lot to try to prove the importance, but if the people aren't implementing at the top and it comes all the way down, then it just doesn't happen. Yeah, do you have any tens for the listeners that are looking to, you know, gain the buying of the sea suite or their direct fige. Managers to implement change or process to better enable the Reps. well, if you're coming up with the change in process, my tip would be that you needs. You need to put the case together where they the sea suite sees the value in it. Don't be afraid to go in in town and make it clear that if they don't see the value in it, let's not spend the money on it. Yeah, let's be very clear about this. If the and I had that customers, it came to me and I realize very early on that actually, the people of top don't see the value. They're expected to send their custom there, their sales people on training course and then they're going to come back and be better. Well, that's just not going to happen, right. So so you got to look at it. You think, okay, if you don't want to do this, then I strongly recommend you don't waste your money with me, because it is a waste of money and I don't want to be tied up to failure. Yeah, what I want to be tied I want to be someone cause says this really worked for us. You know, it's great, did the great job, rather than saying well, yeah, we did it, but it didn't really work. So I don't want to do that. So I you know, the tip is to make sure that you're so committed that you're willing to say we're going to walk away because you guys don't want to do it. You know, if you're trying to do it just to get some business, then it's a different ball game. But I would say you're very strongly, verily on is get time at the very top. Find out what keeps him awake at night, you know, find out what it is about the in the C suite that's the real issue, and then use that as part of your tools to figure out what you need to implement for the sales force. Yeah, I think that's huge. Right there is making sure that they that they see the value that's going to add. And then you'd mentioned there's like don't be afraid to walk away at they're not as committed to it as you are. Yeah, it's a mistate that you'll see. HAP It often as some people there are not some puel the people selling the product or the consultancy. It are wanting it more than the actual fire is wanting it exactly, and that's just that's just doing for failure. It's just like you want it because you want to make a sale, and I get that. And there are times you say, okay, look, if you really want me to do this, I'll do this, but do understand it's not going to work. Yeah, and if you really insist on it, then I'll do it and I'll, you know, make my money and walk away. But that shouldn't happen. It really shouldn't happen. You should be able to say sorry, it's not going to happen. Find somebody else. Yeah, anything about the long term effects that that could potentially cause to not only for your brand, but that customers probably not coming back to you if it didn't work out the first time? So absolutely, and the most...

...important thing in the customers referrals. Yeah, especially when you're consultant. You know someone who says, Oh, you should use sell, so it's really good, rather than saying yeah, we use to consultanty wasn't very good and it's left that that. You know what I mean. It's that referral side of it which makes business continue to grow for you. But now he's a consultant. You know as a company, you know in the products will you know you sell. It's about referrals really that make it work, and if you haven't got good referrals, it doesn't work. Yeah, no, definitely. So you don't we try a little bit about especially on the consulting side there? And you spent many years consulting and more specifically really training teams on the Miller hyman methodology, which is one of many sales methodologies. Can you tell us a little bit more about what that is? So the Middle Harman methodology is really based around three major roles of the salesperson. There's three things the salespersons. The first one is they get to develop and create opportunities. And when you look at creating opportunities, you know you look at cold calling, all these different things. That's not what I'm talking about. What reality is that ninety percent of our new opportunities come from existing customers. So we always say that every time you talk to a customer you should have prepared well enough that you can start digging to see, if, say, new opportunities, and it is that preparation and if that methodology put in place that allows to prepare for that interaction with the customer to ensure you come out of that but not only succeeding with what you with the customer needed, but also with a really good idea of what they're doing in the future, what else might be there for you later. So creating opportunities really critical. Is the very first part of the Miller Haim process. The second part is, okay, you got an opportunity. Now we got to track it. We've got to make sure we know what we know and we know what we don't know. We'd be able to fly what we need to do and have actions some place, to be able to communicate with the customer and track the whole opportunity right from from cradle to great to win it closes. And that's that's the opportunity management tool and that's really critical because our objective is always to try to move the deal forward. Every interaction, every discussion, is about moving the deal forward and also helps us filter to you know, we may not know everything about the customer, we may not know enough, but we have to know enough to say this is not a good deal, we shouldn't do this, we can't do this, and you know my motto is very straightforward. If you're going to win, try to win quickly, but if you're going to lose, lose quickly. Losing slowly is painful, it's depressing, it's wasting resources and it's not good in the company. You know, there's nothing worse for sales guid than to lose, especially when he's been that something for a year, as I always have people who sit there and say I can't drop this deal, I've been working on a year. Yes, but you're never going to get it. So you don't want to be here in two years telling me you still work it on this deal. You know, we just got to bite the bullet and say it's over. The other does as I always say, it's the dead horse. It's on the floor. You can't keep kicking it. It's not going to come up. It's done. So it's really important to try to lose as quickly as possible. And that's what the the imagine the opportunity side. And the third part of the Pie is...

...managing the relationship. So how are we going to manage or measure our relationship over a three year term? Where do we want to be in two or three years with the customer at a relationship level. Do we want to be still just as supplier? Do we want to be a partner? Do we want to, you know, be really linked into their organization? Where do we want to be and where do they want to be with us? Yeah, there's nothing worse than a plan of where you want to go with a customer that the customer has never seen or agreed on. The number of companies that have account plans and I look at them and say, is a customer no, you want to do this. No, well, if you're not going down the same road where you're going here. Okay, you're hoping here. This is so where's kind a better chance if you both agreed with the customers. So that account planning exercise, we always say at the end of it you need to discuss with your customer to make sure they're on the same tract as you do. They want to be in the same place in the relationship as you do in three years, because if they don't, then you just wasting time and money. These things take time, these things they resources. So those are the three sort of spokes, if you like, of the Millheim beside. It is all kinds of stuff, other programs, a score card and all kinds of things negotiating. But that's the three major, major sort of pillars of the milerheimen approach. Ohay, fantastic. So it is, you know, creating the opportunity. I I love that you'd mentioned that the ninety percent of our opportunities come from current customers. Yeah, they're already there. They'reight in front of you. It's just doing the research up front. That's a guy is, I think, something that a lot of us overlook. We're always looking for new pipeline. Where is like, it's right, it's right, it's in, right in front of you. Dig In absolutely widen the scope, you know, unless you've got a hundred percent of your customers walled share, which none of us do, you know there's you're leaving money in the table somewhere. Someone else was picking that up. So, yeah, happened. And then the second thing you'd also mentioned there about taking your customer on that journey with you on those account plans. Yea, and that the reminds me of. So with outreach we have something called success plans, which does that exactly, kind of maps out the journey for that customer and everyone goes along on it together, so we're all agreed to the outcome there. What are some ways that you've been able to see your team at especially at Excel, you be successful in taking customers on that journey as well and kind of having an agreed account plan. So I mean the beauty of that for me is Celia, which is great, is that the relationships we have with the customers because of the breadth of product we sell to them, and it's airline software, so that's quite a big breadth right from right from order to processing at the end, almost requires you to have that long term relationship with the customer because they are making quite a long term commitment. The sale cycle could be anything up to two years, so you need that relationship. So they're making a quite a long term commitments, so they want to have that relationship and so they need they need to be presented the journey and I think, as Sally, as you know, we're doing pretty good at that, and I'm some a couple of bigger customers, is this is the journey we're going to go down and the journey we want to work with you down. And you know, are you happy with that? And...

...absolutely in. Some of them say, let me help drive that journey, which is great, and that's why we have coaches, and we call him coaches. You know, that's a mile him in term, but it's coaches around, you know, making us succeed, helping US succeed. So they're the ones who sort of in there. You know what a coach is, sponsor, whatever you want to call anybody who's ever sold knows what a coach is. Yeah, there's may have a different name for but they've all had them, and so they're the people that help you succeed. So it's it's creating that journey with them. Absolutely in that and so unfortunate I'm not in a company it sells products that have, you know, a one week, one week sales cycle and you don't have relationships are is really all about relationships, which is what really excited to me about quicken with the set it, because that's fantastic. That's really but I believe in yeah, no, that is amazing. I mean, we're all human at the end of the day and that's what we are looking for. So it's talking to people and getting another what they need. Where do they look at to achieve and how can you help them do that? Yeah, absolutely. How would you say? You know, how like deal management and opportunity manage it management. How have you seen this, or maybe the prioritization of Opportunity Management Shift Post pandemic? Is there any trends that you've been able to identify? Well, post pandemic, it just change our communication medium quite dramatically. Yeah, in that I don't know if you've noticed, but you know, calls get to the point a lot quicker. Yep, you don't have all that. That what I think. You know, I called the great socializing in the beginning, where you where you build that relationship, where you build credibility, you actually have calls, you sit down, you have calls, you have an objective, you finish the calling, you move on to the next one. You know, I called then. There are certain days in my Home Office I feel like I'm speed dating. You know what I mean that, and if you ask me what my first call was about in the morning, I's Er to say I don't remember. That's a such a long time ago, you know, and it you could never achieve that if you're seeing customers spacetoface. But it gave me the chance to think. So I think there's an adaptation that's happened that you have to keep. are starting to put blank outs in their diaries, not get time to think. So that's changed a lot in how we work with their customer. It is not change in the methodology. We still do that. The Opportunity Planning and actually, what's really great about it as we can start having your reviews across the world. You know, it's not known an you know, in a room anymore. You can have reviews, you can have and customers, a lot of customers will accept a fifteen minute call. Yeah, you know where's before, when it's an appointment, you and I got to put us out an hour. So I'm I don't want to do that now. You quite easily get a fifteen minute call because it's only fifteen minutes. Lot in the customer is working from home or wherever, and that quite happen to accept it. So I think there's good things about it and I think that them we're going to end up with a combination of both. I mean that's pretty obvious, but there has been some good things about it and and this kind of stuff is taken off. You know, video conferencing has been around for as long as I've been around. We've all had lived a video conference rans. We don't want ever use them because they were not very good. Now it's working great, you know, finally, so there's been something that said we really need this, so this has got to work and great tools have been developed in it work. So it's...

...a combination. But we you know, the tools still have to still work pretty well. It's just all online. So it's fine, all right, that's it. Yeah, I definitely agree. Brevity has definitely what I would say brevity is one of the positive things that are on the outside of this. People are more streets. The point can be a lot more efficient with her day and get a lot more executed in that day simply because you're not having to execute all the travel time as well, which is nice. So moving on from here, if a company was looking to really build out their enablement division and kind of be set up for success, what are like your top three tools that you cannot live without based on your experience? So the main tool crum that. It's got to be the number one tool, and I think anybody who sells any of the tools of enablement knows the basis has to be the crm. And Funny Enough I've worked with companies. One especially had something like Tenzero salespeople and never had to Cem. You know, it's just just wild wall watch just arive. Yeah, it just was just wild to watch. It just looked at thought, well, how do you guys survive? And you realize I survive. Everybody works in a silo. So it doesn't really matter. But that doesn't work. And and I like to say they're implementing crum now, but but it's absolutely critical. But it's also critical that it's used properly and the sales foresee it as a useful tool for them, not as a management reporting tool. Yeah, okay, most people see the crum as a management reporting tool, and so it needs they needs push and use from both sides, and so it's how they're used. Probably. So I'd say crum is is the very first one. The second one, which is methodology, and I'm not saying Miller him in or corn fery or whatever whatever you use, have a consistent methodology across the company. Most of us work across different companies, different cultures, different world, difference countries. Yeah, we need a common language. We may not have a common language when we speak, but we need a common language and when we talk about opportunities, and so methodology gives you that. It gives you that common language, it gives you that ability to identify what you need to do next, what you don't know and what you do know, what your flags are. So methodologies are think, very important. And the third one combination of things. But but it's about getting the right information to the right person at the right time. So, whether that means a content management system, whether that means some kind of con tech system, whether that means teams, but well organized. The worst thing you get is people chasing around looking for some information again and again and again. Yeah, and we don't have a common commonplace where it's stored, where it's index where it's updated, where it doesn't go stale. Those are all things that are really I think one of my thorns. I seen many companies has, if you ask half the guys where to get something, that I just call somebody in marketing, but that waste people time. I'm both scientifical besides, of the coin. You know why. It has got to be a way so that content management's absolutely critical and...

...that's why things has been so successful, although I'm not really whatever that keen on sharepoint, but it's got his benefits. It's just how you index it and stuff. But there are so there are a lot of tools out there for that, and now you won't mention them, but but yeah, those are my, I think, my tree, I would say, if you're going to start up, starting up the sales force, that sales nailment, sales force in general, and you need three tools. Okay, yeah, I know. I think that is arm one hundred percent on that. They need it. They need to have a space where they can find everything. And then the content management system hands down. I know, like based on my experience, is people are constantly chasing to find different things and so when you have like that one house of all the records and all the information they go to, it makes it that much simpler for them to figure it out on their own and they you self sufficient as well. Yeah, and people call methodology a playbook, so you want to call them playbook, called the playbook, it doesn't matter what you call it, but it's some some way, some process. We used to sell. That's all it's about really. Yeah, fantastic. Well, thank you so much. Vins for sharing all of your insight today on how to really build out in an ablement program really gain the buy in from the top down, as well as make sure that this is an ethos within your entire company. For our listeners today, if they were looking to connect with you and chat about your experience, excel you or even more sales enablement for it'd be the best place for them to reach out to you linkedin. My linkedin profile is basically everything. I keep it pretty well up to date. You can contact me there. I do except most connections as long as I know the person. It's Sur random. I don't know the first I don't accept it, but please do. You can message me linked in. I'm there. Just been s multies. Okay, fantastic. Well, you heard it here first and thank you so much for joining us for today's episode. Have every day. Thank you. This was another episode of the sales engagement podcast. To help this get in front of more eyes and ears, please leave us a shining five star review. Join US at sales engagementcom for new episodes. Resources in the book on sales engagement to get the most out of your sales engagement strategy, make sure to check out outreach that ioh the leading sales engagement platform. See you on the next episode.

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