The Sales Engagement Podcast
The Sales Engagement Podcast

Episode · 3 years ago

Breaking Down the Agoge Methodology and How to Engage Effectively at Events

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

If you’re looking for out of the box, insanely effective ways to train your new SDRs and stand out at events, you’re going to love this.

On this episode, we talk with Sam Nelson, SDR Agoge Leader at Outreach, as he shares with us incredible insight into the beauty of the Agoge methodology. Tune in!

Welcome to the sales engagement podcast,this podcast had brought you my outreach, Ot tio, leading sales of EsenPlatform, heping companies, sellers and customer success engaged with fires andcustomers, and the modern sales ero check out sales, an agcom for newepisodes, resources and the book on sales amugement. Coming soon. Now,let's get into today's episode. What's going on Everyon Scott Parker,here, head of partnerships at sales hacker and I am joined by a veryspecial guest, Mr Sam Nelson, at SDR agog leader, elrt outbreach dot, Io SamWelcom, op, bodcast, man how's it going all right thanks for hading me at Pun,to have you, man, xcited, be picking your brain, and you know I want toquickly just set the stage a d you mind, giving us the baseball card stats onyour career today. So two thousand and seventeen I was the number one str biha pretty good margin, iner miss quota. I was when the went to presiencs club.After about a year I was made manager and since I was made manager, I'veramped all all the Rep. so my whole time managing I've been with new scrsand getg them rat up sweetman. So so you, the one when a brand new bdrsdrcomes on board, You'e, getting them fired up and ready to go to battle yeah,so they'll yen, my tam for three to four months and then they'll transitiononto another team, afterward got it makes sense and it just for thelisteners out there, because I know this isn't video. So as we are notfilming. This SAM is sitting in this studio and he has this bright royalblue hair that you can probably see from the moon, maybe Mars, and I gottaask them: What's the story behind the booe hair, so the blue hair so want tosay it was like. Maybe five months ago we had a new class come in and we did kind of Anan experimented our each,where most of our top performers had actually not done Seles before theykind of plugged in the oureach, and they just kind of like crushed it,either right out of college or from a totally different discipline ind. So webrought in this big new class of probably like our least experienceclass effort just on average- and I told him hey if you guys like onaverage, is a team, I'm break the record for the highest averageattainment or the most sols. I think the previous record was was five thevery first month. I said if you beat that old DIY, my hair, blue, just peopl, the fourth of July, was wasComig up, and so I thought Blu be patriotic and they beat it and theyactually, as a team, they averaged higher than the Ferstmont referd Bu Piit crazy goid, and so I died my air blue and it's actually been like thebest professional decision of Everin. So I've actually really liked. So those this ters out there pickyourself a color and who knows where you're hor career might go. I len itcool. So let's dive into that, so you've kind of become famous for this.A Goji tribe approach to you know: onboarning. Can you walk we throughwhat that is exactly yeah, so the GOI tribe? It's actually well it's frs agogay. But every time son reads: They Fall A God. You sort just rolling withthe cates R gone rt trademarket a new word right here. Right now, the agosyou tried and we actually Sparto was the first. They were the first THIRC tocome up with it so sparta greatest warriors of all time. When newer critswould come on to train to be warrioes, they would actually all of the newpeople would go into. One group called the Agoji and you have all the newpeople in one place. They train temmonst each other manen hey'llgraduate on to Bein warriors right, right, right and so kind of took theidea from Sparta and has actually...

...worked out. Surprisingly. Well, so Itrain all of the Europ, so I can actually specialize in issues specificto new raps right. So you totally think of Oen EW rap. That's going to takelike a lot of the managers band with, but actually, if you have a managerthat specializees an issue specific to any raps, you can actually increase thecapacity forny raps right, so I've actuallytypically have like the biggest SDR team. Just because I can pouson onthose issues, yeah make sense so like traditionally you know you bring on anew SGR. You got your SR manager who has five hundred and one other thingsto worry about. You know he's got his opportunity goal. He's got his otherraps. This way, you remove all that other stuff and you're able to focusone hundred percent of your attention on making this rap successful, jistlike groundhug day every single month, questions that they have and the thingsthat surprise them are not surprising to me yeah. I can coach them throughthings just like it very used to like what how a you, Rampin Irap yeah. Thatmust be really cool for you when, when you see them go and then go on to havehave success, is that kind of what keeps you motivated and Hungry andhaving fun? Oh yeah, I mean I mean a successful team. Is a happy tame, nomatter what? But actually it's really fun to just be focused on raps duringthe firt couple of months, because they're all pumked up, no matter whatlike every Radis FUNCI during the first few months, yeah so like having themall in a team and having that energy. I mean that alone is like supermotivating for me just to have kind of that energy kind of intrinsic to theteam. Absolutely- and I think that's like they've got this plasiticity, youknow at he at that stage, right they're, so open to new ideas and concepts,whereas when you go down the line in sales and business development, youpick up these like bad habits of these habits. Of these ways of doing things.You kind of have this fresh, empty slate, which I think is so cool yeahand there are a blank slave which makes them really good for just kind of likedralling down best practices, and I went from knowing absolutely nothingabout sales to learning about sales, so I've kind of been where they've been,but it's also just a very good incubator for a new processas new ideaslike every SCR manager out there has like ideas and like processes that theycan implement that they know. Ud Be Successful. You've got a rips on quotaand they have like a certain way that they know works. Good enough. You Ogetting them to make. The leap is sometimes kind of hard when you have anAgoji. Are you focusing on the brand new raps, it's much easier to implementnew processes that you know ere going to make the team better right and whatwe've seen in the AGOJI is that we can implement these new practices and theydo really well and then the rest of the team will kind of come in and Sayheywhat's going on there and instead of you like trying to force them with theStak, it kind of becomes a care where they want to say hey what are theseguys doing and they kind of Takein on themselves to implement the new stuffthat makes sortof sense. I like that. Well, let's, let's talk about someresults, then, so you know what effect has this had on the outreach bd team? Ithink, culturally, it's been a really good thing. So, when the angoges comein after two months, they actually becomea mentor to the newegogees who they're training with each other and just likeright off the bat. You have kind of some responsibility for someone else,so it makes the team like a little bit more Closean it. It avoids clicking ISSthik happen in sales teams as far as results. No one that's been throughTego Jesmus quota wow like that on letll dout, you thou MIDAS Ralli,someone Wilas gone at some point, but so far noones mas quota were in twohundred and thirty five percent last month, and so cra gone going really.Well, that's awesome, so yeah for those listers out there. We, our Mike, isattached to the desk, but if it Wasnan I'd be droppin it right now for sure that's awesome, then so I'm sold thet.You know I used to be a bd manager...

...myself, you know in a past life, andthis makes a lot of sense to me. You know, because there's it's justimpossible to give your full attention to a rap is too much going on, so I'mso, and for someone looking to implement this, you know Spartanapproach. Where should they start? If you have a team, that's big enough likeif Youre bring on enough new raps, then four months you can have like a decentsize. Team volunteere t be the AGOJI leader like. I am convinced that it isthe funnest job in Jack you're over, like all of the newsdrs. If you have anew ideas going to implement you an you, just have them going in. Like thirtydays, you, like the mad scientist, it isn't and Youve got the hair to back otthat KNO and they're super fun and they get excited about things, and it's justlike a super super fun position. So I highly recommend just suggesting beingheghosyo leader yourself. If you have a team, that's big enough. I wrote anarticle on Linkdon that spells out exactly how to do it. Cool. If youdon't have a team, that's big enough. You actually have kind of an edge wit.The whole reason that a Gogi is a big deal for big teams is that once youhave like a huge sales team, new changes are very hard to implementright and the agoges a way for you to do that. You can kind of disrupt yourown team just like a started disrep like a scale industry, cool yeah, butfor smaller teams. You just focus in on the brand new reps and you can just dothe you. Can the exact same strategy you'll just have it a little bit easier,implementing new modern practices in you team right right? Let's talk aboutthat for two seconds. Is this something you know? Do you need twenty plus raps,what's kind of the optimal in your eyes for for adopting this approach? As faras team size goes, this team size goes, it depends on a lot of other things inother companies. I've always taken on a lot of Reps. I have nine right now willbe eight but yeah. Typically, I mean, if you hade a team of like five or sixbrand new reps. you can take that weight off the other managers. They canincrease their capacity a little bit. So I think if you have five or six newrepsion of formonth period, it's a reasonable time to start thinking aboutit, an a coachy cool and I goin to ask: How did you come up with this concept?Well, Sparta came up with it Ike. I can't think all the ces art is alwayscool man. Yeah, you know you don't want to e movie part hundred yeah. You sawthe movie tou Ad C, Het's God, so it will actually. So when I was in college,one of my hacks for college was like I would go to class and you wouldn't. Iwas wer. I started ackto this fun, so I would go to class. There's like anafternoon an Asireallylleg so like there's like tente people in class andyou're, like listening to your instructor in the Instructoris, likethe expert at the university on Calculus Frexam, will no better thananyone else. They live ind breathe, that's everything they do and they knewit super well. The problem is, they haven't necessarily gone from, knowingnothing to learn calculus for the first time. So, while they may know it'ssuper super well, they can get a little bit detached from going from zero toone a little bit going rim zero to learn again yeah. So what I would do is,I would just skit class and iwoul go to the TA lab, because the TS had justfairly gone through it lik faster right. It was just wit, a way more efficientway to learn. I luess is kind of a similar thing where the agois beingtrained by the the other agoges that isn't barely gone from, knowing nothingto the learning something yeah and then I've been in s Yar before to, and I cankind of help referee make sure they non go crazy. Tell so thanks, that's awesome than no. I love that Ithink it's. I think it's genius and I think that's a there's, a college hackfor you to so Badn universe year, College. Okay, so I want to switchgears a little bit just because we are in September the heat of conferences,an effect there's a new conference coming out at least one a week. Two orweek. Sometimes you got dream forest...

...just around the corner. I want to talkabout events, because I've heard that you're kind of the king at creatingopportunities, preduring and post event. So let's kind of walk through thisquickly, and can you walk me through starting with how you pret for an eventyeah, so they think? Well, I think events in general, like this big openspace like sending an SDR to an event, sounds like a bad idea, but it'sactually a good idea. So not a lot of people are doing it. So you have yourfirst advantage right there. So there's a lot to explore was worke for me a lotas booth hustling Igo, an aricle that Ilinkden a became super popular andit's essentially just preparing beforehand, going up to booth, gettingopportunities there and then do the follow the afforts it people h didright, so not not so focused on the attendes but focused on the the othersponsors that wer saying Yeah Nice. So, like I guarantee Y, U Dream Force lastyear that more opportunities were generated with one syear booth hustling.Then some people who spend a million dollars whith theyre, both an Dreangforse right. That's like threethosanddollars yeah yea. So it'slike massively disruptive Han like no one's doing it right now, so they'rehuge returns yeah. Why do you think no one's doing it? I think it's a goodidea. That sounds like a bad idea right. You say I think we should send a Nsyear, Toan advent. You try to bring that to like the VP sales, who doesn'tus, maybe a little bit more detached from like what it's like to be anNesyar and how everchange fer generated yeah. It sounds like a bat idea yeah,but it's a good idea. Yes, so that's why noone's doing I t there's a hugeopportunity right now, yeah I like it yeah and it makes sense right likethey're out there when you say bothass thing like an Srbeda, their job is tohustle and if you position it to them, be like how many calls do you makeevery day look around you, you have an opportunity to. Maybe you get. You know,hold o three people a day. Well, you're in a room of a thousand people rightnow go have some ondemand conversations whenever you want o yeah and it's like.So you want to have conversations, but the prep is everything right. You don'twant to just like go to a conference halfcock you yea, like I will preparefor about twelve hours before a conference Kay. So the first thing youwant to do like both hustling is one strategy like moral emergees, morepeople start going, O doferens is an emphasizing and o start just clarifytheiir. So when you're, this booth hustling strategy when you're preppingfor it are you just looking at you know the organizations that are going to bethere? Are you making a brest like you know, as the gestimate? Who is theactual title? That's going to be there as well? Is that what Youe do yes? So Iwill but yeah like this whole process takes me like twelve hours, I'll gothrough first o one to look at the sponsors. You'll always get that if youcan get the people who are actually going to have booths, sometimes theykeep that hidn, but if they don't take that list, something ut that in thelist form figure out everyone who's a currect customer everyone who's notfigure out this status, ith everybody there yeah and then you find a map withthe event and you figure out for the ventores that are not yet customers.That could be good customers, your on o sales navigator, and you figure outlike WHO's. The highest drinking person will likely be there Kay you put theirname down then, when you go to the event you like have a map ofwhereeverone is, and you have a name of someone to go to an each place whereyou keeping that information. You have that in your phone, like on a note howyou keeping this all, it's funny yo ask that. So when I went to events likeI've gone to deciber security conferences like on Slakhaso Soirusecurity, there is so much mesee money, pump, intciber security right now, yeahyeah, there's, actually a freaking O mazing convrerce Kan just laking aspectacle and swag its like trigker treaing for adults and Stericso man. Soso actually, but at those events, like hackers will actually try to hack thisenvents like for bragging rights, and so I can't be getin so ye Lukin. What Iuse, I actually Hav a printed sheet, but that not whatevera that's Coolit,...

...but yeah. So I have this sheet thereand and yeah just kind of like go out andand start talking to people coo makes Sodo sense and are you doing anythingunsocial beforehand like are you you know sending these people a connectionrequest? Are you seeing you know if anyone, maybe in your org, is connectedto them? Are you going that further? You basically just focus here. Thecompanes want to talk to here the people I want to talk yeah, so thecompanies of people I want to talk to. I have a presha sequence. Kays. Myexact sequences in my are both hustling article nout, a we well do like ashorte segments before and we'll occasionally get a couple meetingsbefore conferences, but the need of it is like when you get there right soI'll dea it the prepwer beforehand, you Kgo and you talk to people at the righttimes and then you do good follon leve it okay. So that's our fret now we'reat the event we're feeling overwhelmed because there's nine hundred and fortypeople in the room. What are your tips on networking effectively other than,of course, this booth hastleing sttretch. So a few things like wellwhen you're, actually both hustling yea, you need to go to them at the righttime. This is like comparative okay. When people when the sales people arestanding around awkwardly, that is, when you go just wantto by they willtalk about the sharks, come out. Yeah they'll engage you and if e, if theydon't, then they should be getting in trouble yeah. Well it because the thingis like they're standing there, a no one's going to their booth tat, likealmost like, looks bad for hus right e'll go and ask you what you doand allsudden you're in the position, but every cold color wants fhor they're,asking you what you do totally yeap if you're selling cells and markting I'sjust like an Homerih, yeah yeah decision maker you're like theretalking to this ISO, make woe est me wat. You do yeah yeah! That's that's sointeresting to look at it that way like when you're at a networking event,someone asks you, but you do imagine if you're on a cold call and someone askyou that that's when Your Eyes Lai up and Ye. Oh, my God here we go. That'sawesome! Well, dude the best thing about with assling your events. Just tecan't hang up on you maybe to a drink in your face, that'sabout it, yeah, okay, so other other tips to so that'sa great one. I love that so, when they're standing around, don't do it?Obviously, when they're at Max Capacityo, do you have any tips on likejust how to enter a conversation? You like good opening lines like how do youusually start these conversations? These are very simple Okan. They willstart the conversation for you, so it's differently. Co, Reistat theconversation for you. You give them a really brief kind of just like a brieforeview of what you do and ow it relates to them. You know you're haw areleases to traitjust. If you can yeh and then you ask for the decision makerthey'll tell you where they are and you can typically get a meeting or somekind of the conversation, just kind of evolves. Like a natural conversation,yeah cool Ecaus not like really is Crot, for it sounds good and then, let's flipthat, let's say you're on booth duty. How are you engaging people if you haveto be stuck ith, booth and you're, not on the Tassle Dude, Okay Yeah? I didthis and dream force last year. You just need to be pro active K. I amsurprised at how many people just kind of like stand there shocking Wer, it'sshocking. I was there last year and I was walking around and like the amountof people that were on their phone and all I could think of it's like someone signed a you know, hundredthousand to a million dollar check that time that you're on the phone. That'slike that minute is like a seven hundred, a fiftyar minute that you'rewasting for your companya ight. Now, yes, it's crazy, so yeah, it's justlike being proactive, get comfortable as being uncomfortable, like a lot ofus are used to being behind email and being behind video calls. It's like anew motion actually for some inside sales people yeah just ike that thereand talk to everyone, Tha lingoes in front of you, yeah yeah. I was superlucky, so an my my career, I got started doing like face face doortordor like hostling. So like that's what...

I learned first and then I learned theemail and the phone, so it's kind of like more natural, but it's so funnythat there's like a whole slew of sales, people that, like never talk, face theface ever yeah, that's cool man. So let's talk a little bit then about. Ithink this was always the hardest one. For me, having experience being atboost being at trade, sows it's okay! I just went. I had a bunch of greatconversations. You know you leave the conference. You leave dream Fort youlike wow. I just created fifty ops lik. I had all these great conversations andthen you send your followup email or you send your calendar, invite orwhatever it is, and it's just crickets one of the most heartbreaking thingsever so. How do we make sure that we don't get lost in the barage of terrible, terrible followups thatinevitably come after events yeah? So the the hardest part of the SDRposition of my opinion is getting like the first initial attention: okay, likejust getting their attention. If you talk to Soni Ti, show like you alreadyhave that, and so you've got that going for you,where, when we would do events actually about half of my new opportunities butactually come afterward in the following nice, so we get a lot thereand then I would wait a week and a half justbecause, right after the event, HEU get tons of people for us with emails, an okind of sick of it yeah. I may Il look the same thing I'll sound the same.Everyone who's doing event follow up emails. Please change your template yeah and then in one of the ways tomake sure that you takn out it some like the kind of conversations you havewith people, because you get that in the first line yeah then they will jogtheir memory. They'll, remember you they'll be much more likely to openyeah yeah and then we have like a whole show seqents Thi's, also on bothhustling article that you can just kind of set the steps. N NOREAC just turn iton and let it go nice and well link those articles somewhere. I went thisco podcast Gos by cool during the event, a lot would come at the followur you'dwait a week and a half. How else would you kind of like differentiate yourselfout of the crowd so definitely go trick or treating forswag? Nice definitely do that because, like sometimes like, if you can getthem to open it, you have like a picture of you like in your tshirtright or like using I figet spinner or like something Ye Donb like that theyjust Hav like it gets they're not used to it yeah,yea and so collect swag. For that purpose. Look through Your BusinessCards, Yeah O. actually like another thing, just like when you're on thefloor, yeah don't bring business cards is my advice. ress they go kin atsounds kind, er intuitive, but when you're talking to Somon the Lop Tandsay, Oh just give me Your Business Card hell call you back right, whit'h acough out they're trying to get rid of you right. That's that's ust close tohanging up as you can do, Iversy! No one goes through finds WI business.Caran says: Oh, I want to call Sandy, so you want to get there business card.So just I don't have this. Is Car l canaers right an if they don't have itsay we'll just give me a number yeah they just that's import. Do you everconnect on the spot on like Linkdin or something? No, I don't one thing. One thinganother thing I was thinking is: If this particular event does have anApttho like, I don' think there is a better way to get like text responsesfrom see. Littl people then messaging them on an AB atsome Evet, becausethere's stuck in this event, you're, probably going to be one of only fewpeople that messages them on Thead IV had crazy success. Doing that reallyyeah and Wat. What are you saying what what's like your? What's your one lineor that you're shooting these guys? Well, it depends so I do researchbefore I figure he's my priority. Why the're my priority, yeah and then I'lljust say, hey like say we connected with you a few months ago and we reallywanted to circle back, like I know, you're speaking at this time, I'd loveto connect with you, afterward yeah, something like that yeah then I have avery good responsen from Lik Seelat, like C has of ir s Nice Yeah, it's allversaturat like I know when I go to conferencs and I got to a lot ofconferences, I'll maybe get one or two...

...messages from you know through tha,which is crazy because I'll get forty emails. So you definitely want to go inthe channels that are less saturated awesome. So I'm going to share a quicktip that really helped me actually with follow ups, because, as I mentionedearlier, I used to be really good at having awesome conversations, and Iwould always think that I had all these opportunities, but you know I' betalking to see level people and sure we had a great connection. Yes, they hadsome pain, but just because there were so many terrible follow up emails, Iwould get lost. So what I started doing is right in the heat of that moment,when you know you're having a good conversation. You've talked about thechallenges. They're like this is awesome. Make sure that you email meMondy, that's literally what they would say it, and then someone get back to me.So I started doing I'd, be like okay I'll. Do that and how you're going toknow it's me is I'm going to put blue monkey in the subject lint and, andthat way you know when you see this you're going to laugh you're going toknow it's me and it's going to take you right back to the spot and they be likethat's awesome. Let's, let's do it and you don't have to do blue monkey comeup with your own, something ridiculous, Thay totally yeah so do in it really really helpedman like I like once I started doing that and I still use it today. FinallyEnough I get a hundred percent response right and then it usually starts areally funny banter and it's a good way to kind of start. I A relationship offyeah. I love that N Haveas Alldo that Ts Really Osa and blue monkey mightactually work better for you because you get the blue air. I love it. Okay, so is we kind ofwrapped this up and I want to ask you one more question and I'm going toleave this purposely dag. You know this is the sales engagement podcast right,so a d? You can take this wherever you want to go. You know what other tips doyou have for people looking to engage more effectively with prospects orcustomers online or Offi yeah, I'm going to say, don't confuse common practice with bestpractice. There are a lot of. There are a lot of jobs and there are a lot ofindustries. Where that's the case. Where things done change, you figureout what works an that stays that way forever being in SDR sales development,general speut standing out and it works three months ago- may not work anymoreyeah. So you'll Wantt, you figure out what the common practice is, isprobably outdated. Taas, so don't confuse common practice with bestpracticeand. You have to stand your toes. It's constantly changing. I lovethat I love that and could not agree more right ifeellike as soon as youcatch up and like you like. Oh my God, this is working. That's the the pointthat it stops wortin. So you hat to constantly iterate. I think it's. Whatmakes business development so fun and sale so fun right. If you just canfigure out a magic formula and then repeat, then you know that's when we'regetting replaced by real quick, not lit. No, I just kidting, but thatthat's what I mean right. That's thet creativity and that's the the humanelement of sales is always changing and adapting and that's cool man. That's agreat piece of advice and a great tip anything else. You want t to end offwith per San. No, I guess just like to follow up on don't confuse commonpractice with best practice. TES A lot of people misunderstand how creativeSeles development is. I know it is like a profession that, like is constantlychanging, constantly, have to stay in your toes and it pulls certain itforces you to learn how to be uncomfortable and to find opportunities.Fhore. Other people, don't t, see them and their skill, so you don't get invery many jobs, and so it's a very, very good first job to have. Sometimesit's not easy to see that when you're right in the middle of it, when you getonto your next position, you will just ask anyone. Wha's been a ES. Youabsolutely here here man, I would. I would back that up at tenthouzand four,that yeah business feltmins one of the greatest career choices you can. Youcould pick especially ronly on all right, Sam well, Fr a Gogi leader atout reach. Thank you so much for...

...sharing all your your wisdom, man andyour insight. I was a great conversation and Axmon. This was another episode of the SalesAngagement podcast Jona at sales, engagementhcom or new episodes,resources and the book on sales. AGAGEMENT COMING SOO to get the mostout of your sales andgaging strategy, make sure to check out out reach io theleading sales and Metel Plat. So you on the next episode.

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